Ep. 58 - Mike Morbach - Crossroads Comedy Theater
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Episode Summary
This week, I sat down with Mike Marbach, founder of Crossroads Comedy Theater, to talk about building new improv artists here in Indy. Mike talked about why improv isn't really about being funny, but rather about reintroducing adults to play, and how that carries over into everyday conversation, relationships, and even conflict resolution. I really enjoyed chatting with Mike today about his work, horror movies, and beyond. I hope you enjoy.
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City Rising — cityrising.org
Music
Jennasen — "Scared Rabbit" (intro music)
Timestamps
00:00 – Cold Open
01:07 – Intro
02:20 – Meet Mike Marbach
06:14 – Play, Improv & the Brain
17:00 – ADHD & Class Transformations
25:00 – Connection Building
29:00 – Improv in Pop Culture
39:00 – The Goal of Improv
48:00 – Being Yourself
58:00 – Arts, Wages & Transit in Indy
1:04:00 – Horror Movies
1:06:00 – Closing Question & Where to Find Mike
Episode Transcript
Mike Marbach
Michael Zarick: [00:00:00] This week I'm talking to Mike Marbach of Crossroads Comedy Theater, a local nonprofit that runs improv classes right here in Indy. I sat down a couple of months ago with Mike after he reached out to chat about third spaces and public transit. The man knows how to get my attention. I loved talking to him today about the similarities between improv and podcasting and how he's working to teach people the art of play in conversation.
I think he's doing really great work Speaking of doing great work, if you'd like to support the podcast directly, you can go to support.thirdspaceindy.com. Thanks to those of you who have chosen to do so already. Beyond that, you can do something as simple as leaving a review on your preferred platform or liking and subscribing on YouTube.
Thanks so much for watching or listening wherever you do, and I hope you enjoy.
[00:01:00]
Michael Zarick: Hello. My name is Michael Zarick and this is Third Space Indy. In 1989, a man named Ray Oldenburg wrote a book called The Great Good Place. And in this book he coined the term the third place. This describes a place that is outside of your home and outside of your work that you can go be together with others, build community and just be yourself.
So I've made it my goal to find people all over Indianapolis who are doing their very best to make those types of spaces all over the city. Which brings me to my guest today. This is somebody who I got connected to by Bo Turner, who is the founder of, Find Fun Indy. And she had an experience with her company, uh, working with this individual.
Uh, and I think some words were shared and some stories were passed along [00:02:00] and the word third space came up and Bo goes, "Oh, I know somebody who does that." Uh, and we got connected over email and we since have only met once before but got coffee, had a good time and I think we found alignment and in terms of the way we think about the world.
Uh, and which brings me to today's guest. I've been talking too much already. today's guest is Mike Marbach, who is the founder and current executive director of Crossroads Comedy Theater.
Mike Marbach: That's what I do. Uh, yeah, thanks for having me on the pod.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Thanks
Michael Zarick: for coming on.
Mike Marbach: I think you captured, uh, how we came to, to this point, uh, pretty, pretty well and it's through Bo Turner who knows everybody. Seemingly.
Michael Zarick: Hey, I like to think, not as- it's not a competition but I think we know a good similar number of people.
Mike Marbach: Uh, well I'm from, I'm from Philly.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, uh, so I, I'm just happy to know [00:03:00] people that know people.
Michael Zarick: from Philly but now you live here with your family- Mm-hmm ... on the south side of Indy.
Mike Marbach: Correct.
Michael Zarick: Uh, but most importantly you run, uh, I failed to say what this is. So Crossroads Comedy, uh, Theater, I'm just gonna call it Crossroads from now on- Yeah
is an improv comedy nonprofit. So you teach people how to do improv comedy. you work with individuals, small groups and sometimes businesses? Yes. Right? And then you're basically taking a number of classes to sort of develop those skills.
Mike Marbach: Yes. Correct.
Michael Zarick: Right.
Mike Marbach: Uh, yes. We teach people, uh, I would say we teach people Improv for everyday use.
a lot of times with improv, uh, that comedy word gets, um, glued to it. which we do. You know, we do. We actually do. We do improv comedy, so it's not by, uh, mistake that the comedy gets attached. Uh, but, uh, our classes, especially our Improv 1, starts off with, the everyday skills that you can learn from [00:04:00] doing, from doing improv, 'cause we improvise every single day-
Michael Zarick: Yeah
Mike Marbach: uh, outside of the classes that we offer, uh, every conversation that you have. Uh, so I like to think, that we help people be better at everyday life-
Michael Zarick: Mm ...
Mike Marbach: um, through our classes. Yeah. But yes, we also train people how to do improv comedy, and we do shows, uh, with the people that we have had through classes.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Definitely. And you just got done with a class too.
Mike Marbach: I did, literally, uh, just about a half hour, half hour or so ago. Yeah. It was an Improv 1 class. Great group, too.
Michael Zarick: Okay. That's interesting. So you said Improv 1. Is that a-- So is that like 101, so you can do, like, 201 and-
Mike Marbach: Yes.
Michael Zarick: Uh ... you can move up the, the, the ladder?
Mike Marbach: Yes. Uh, we have, uh, Improv 1, Improv 2, Improv 3, and Improv 4. Uh, in Improv 1, and we call it Improv for Everyone, and that is kind of like the ground floor. You can come in. You do not have to have any experience whatsoever. You don't even really have to have a desire to perform, [00:05:00] um, or want to perform at all, because the performance aspect of it is, uh, optional.
You're not gonna be, you're not gonna be thrown on stage whether you want to or not. it's for people who really want improv for the, the skill, uh, the skills and benefits of, of doing improv. our, our 2 goes a little bit deeper into that. There are different skills, different techniques, uh, and it does become more of that improv comedy, that more performative element, uh, as you go through 2, 3, and 4, because there are different styles that we go over.
Uh, there are different aspects of improv, ways to start scenes, ways to continue scenes, uh, ways to be funny through very, like, what I call... Or actually, I'm quoting one of my improv instructors, Susan Messing, neck up, uh, ideas, where people who want to get into, to improv, uh, start learning a little bit more about, like, almost the, the science [00:06:00] behind it.
because there is science behind all of it.
Michael Zarick: Um, one thing that I have thought about for, like, quite a bit since you and I first talked, but just in general, is, like, this concept of play in conversation.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: I think in terms of the way we interact now, a lot of things are so formalized, so Base level like, "Oh, how's the weather?"
"Oh, I think the weather is quite good. It's a little humid outside, don't you think?" whereas to truly develop like deep relationships with people, you have to like have a real sense of play with them, not be worried about, You know, s- obviously you have to worry about what you're saying in terms of like who you're insulting, but like not be worried about sort of, being so touchy on a lot of things when you're talking.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: and that idea of being playful in the way you're talking. So are you sort of delving into those topics and sort of interweaving, um, ideas of playfulness in, in conversation and just...[00:07:00]
Well, tell me, tell me what improv is to you. I guess that's really
Mike Marbach: what I'm trying to, yeah. What are you doing? Why are you here? Uh, yeah, uh, in our classes, uh, it really is reintroducing adults to play.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, using your imagination. I talked a minute ago about the science of it. One of my hobbies is, which I have no training in it whatsoever, but just learning about neuroscience, uh, and neuroplasticity.
And the stuff that we do in improv touches on all of those, all of those things. Uh, so even just connecting with people and the things that make you hesitant to connect with someone. the, the idea that play and playing is one of the most, neural, um, uh, neurologically stimulating things that you can do as an adult, and how your brain begins to, uh...
One of the things I learned, is that the brain cannot distinguish between a fact and a thought, which is wild to me, but also explains a whole lot of- ... the [00:08:00] way the world is right now. Yeah, definitely. Right? Um, so your brain starts to take on what you think. So if you don't think that you can do something or you're hesitant to do something, the more you think those things, your brain's like, "All right, I guess we can't."
You know? Why would we spend the energy trying? 'Cause it, the, your brain will lead you to that, to that result. Uh, so, uh, that's where play comes in. That's where improv comes in, trying to get people to f- face those, those somewhat basic fears. Um, especially since the pandemic, especially since screen time has removed so much, interconnection between, between people.
Like you were talking a minute ago about the weather. What I would say we do in classes is we take it from, "Hey, um, it's pretty sunny out today." "Yeah, it is sunny, and it's, uh, a little humid too." and go back and forth like that, touching all these surface things, uh, is like... In our class, it'd be like, "Yeah, and it kind of bothers me because I was gonna do this other thing.
You know, I was gonna go, on a picnic, but I don't wanna be sitting there sweating." [00:09:00] So there's a whole bunch of just going deeper and asking questions and, listening to people rather than just waiting for your opportunity to talk, which is mostly what we do. so yeah, play, um, general attention span we work on.
The pandemic ruined a lot of, uh, a lot of stuff. Screens continue to ruin us, and our attention spans. Uh, when people come and take a class with, with us, they're learning how to reignite their imagination. They're learning how to problem solve in real time. You're faced with a situation in an improv class where you're a doctor and you gotta figure out how to do surgery.
Like, you know, it's so weird, uh, to talk about outside of an improv class. Uh, but, uh, you, you'll have people in there who you can see them transform. Like, not, I'm not saying they become a d- "In that moment, I was a doctor." Like, uh, not like that. But, uh, just [00:10:00] see them... You'll, you'll see them first, some people freeze.
"I don't know. I'm not a doctor. I don't know how to be a doctor." In a few weeks, you can see that same person, uh, take on the attitude of, "Well, I create the reality, so in my world, this is what a doctor does. This is how a doctor behaves." Mm-hmm. Um, so it's like- So
Michael Zarick: you're taking the, the neuroscience idea of can't distinguish between fact and thought and making your own facts with your thoughts.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: Is that ...
Mike Marbach: Yes. Yes. Um-
Michael Zarick: In a playful, like, absurdist way. Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. I mean, the w- think about some of the things the, the people that have written books about it, like, the, the little one-liner things like fake it till you make it, right? That's what, that's what it is.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: And, and the more you think that you can do something, the more likely it is you will, uh, find some success within that thing.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um, and that's what we, that's what we, we do.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. You said a couple of things that I have latched onto. The first thing is that, well, I've already touched on it a little bit, but the [00:11:00] distinction between fact and thought. Someone brought this up to me in terms of, like, the way people become misogynistic is they start making, like, light, like, women-hating jokes, and they just, like, keep doing it.
And then you actually just, like, start hating women because you start making these jokes. It's like, okay, well, ease off a little bit. Like, it's okay to make a joke every now and then, but it's like back up- Yeah ... a little bit. Uh, because that's how you fall into that trap of what, what you said that's how the reality we live in has happened now.
Because people have, a lot of the things that we have done have, like, started off as jokes and then became whatever rea- shared reality we hold.
Mike Marbach: Yeah, and it's also just general interactions, uh, with people. Uh, you may have an interaction where someone is not necessarily giving you the, uh, uh, attention, right?
They may be doing something and just kind of, like, talking to you, but you have no idea what's going on in their life- Mm ... in their moment. Like, what everything that led up to you having that interaction. You may have somebody in a class or that you work [00:12:00] with, uh, that, uh, each time you pass each other in the hall, there's, like, a weird tension, and you have no idea why, and you just start to, like, believe that that person, uh, doesn't like me.
And it's the brain. The brain's just being, being weird. And the more you think those thoughts, the more you start to believe that they're, that they're real, but they're, they're not.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Brain is smart, but it's also weird and easy to fool
Michael Zarick: The other thing you said that I have also latched onto is this idea of listening rather than waiting to talk.
Yeah. Which this podcast specifically has helped me to do.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: I, I, I keep saying I have undiagnosed ADHD, um, outside of the podcast, um, but also within it. And, like, that's such a real thing in my life is that I like to... No, maybe like is the strong word. My brain ref- likes to interject into what people are saying.
But sitting down and Being [00:13:00] intentional with a moment and sitting down with Mike Marbach to talk about Crossroads Comedy, like, "Oh, I, I'm really interested in this and this moment," wanting to hear more about what's going on. And I-- it started to actually carry over into regular conversation too, where- That's
Mike Marbach: good
Michael Zarick: I've clued in. It's like, oh my God, I've transformed into a podcaster. Like, the way I talk to people is so co- question focused. Mm-hmm. It's always g- like I'm delving into their deepest secrets in the first interaction. Uh, so it's funny to see the overlaps in, in what you describe, uh, coming out of improv versus, like, what I've personally experienced doing this.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Uh, and that's what we, that's what we do, 'cause if you do not hear-- If we're doing an improv scene and you don't hear what that person says because you are thinking of what you're going to say, there's no way to build what we call a base reality- Mm-hmm ... where we agree on who we are to each other, where we are, what's going on, why things are happening, any of that stuff.
, Whereas if you [00:14:00] just listen to that person, you can pick up on a lot, uh, because we also talk about, like, whole body listening, um, you know, deep brain listening, to what your scene partner is saying, and not being in a rush to, get to your idea, because you can get to that later. Uh, right now let's focus on, on these two people, and just go back to the, the weather example.
A scene could start off like that. Like, people in, uh, that take our, like, improv one class think that they have to be funny or they have to be clever, and I'll just say like, "No, just come out and say a word. S- make a sound. Uh, come out and start miming washing dishes, and we'll figure out the, out the rest."
People will start their sentences and they'll, and I'm like, "Yeah," I'm like hanging on like, "Oh, this is going great." And they'll be like, "Oh, I, I, I just don't know where I'm going with this." No, you're, you were doing fine.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: You were doing great. But listening is absolutely, huge for people, uh, that come out of our, our classes.
I've been doing improv, this is [00:15:00] my 20th year doing- Dang ... improv. Yeah, 20 years., And, uh, I, speaking of A- ADHD, uh, was diagnosed with ADHD, which I get the post-pandemic boom of- ... of ADHD. And what happened with me, uh, I'm told, um, what my doctor has said, is that, improv, uh, and structure kept a lot of those things in line.
And then the pandemic hit, uh, and that structure fell apart. , And I wasn't doing improv, and I wasn't teaching improv. , But the, the improv really is what, especially now, uh, has just kind of like when I'm teaching a class, I have to pay attention. I have to f- focus you know, all my attention on what is happening right in, right in front of me.
Uh, so even as the instructor, uh, it has helped, uh, and continues to help, to help me. Um, I can't interrupt the scene. I have to be-- If I do interrupt [00:16:00] the scene, it has to be for a reason. I just can't interrupt, uh, for the, for the hell of it, you know? So yeah, listening, waiting, and not waiting for your chance to, to talk, uh, is-- That's a conversation.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: It, it-- The other is kind of just talking at each other.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. You also said something, um, interesting, which is that people were worried about not being funny, but like there's always the joke that like The Onion, uh, is struggling at this time- Yeah ... because our, our reality is like so absurd that it's like, how does The Onion write about something more absurd than that to make you laugh?
It's like- Yeah ... you look at the, the day in, day out o- of things that are happening before our eyes, and it's like, what, what are we doing? You know- Yeah ... that type of thing. Mm-hmm. And like just talking about that, uh, in a natural flowing way can end up being funny. So when you, um, bring it up in improv, I think that's interesting.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: Um, then you mentioned something [00:17:00] about transformation between a first class and then the last class. How many classes are in, uh, let's say the 101?
Mike Marbach: Uh, we do two different versions. One is our newer version, and that's specifically for non-performers. Mm-hmm. People that are like, "I want the skills of improv, but I don't give a shit about getting on stage, and in fact, it terrifies me."
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: But it, it's more about like the everyday skills. Um, the other one is eight weeks. So the improv for non-performers, that's six. Improv one, which has the more perf- more of a performance element, uh, in it, uh, is eight weeks.
Michael Zarick: Okay. And that's one a week, right?
Mike Marbach: One, uh, once a week for two hours.
Michael Zarick: That's it.
That's dope. Yeah. Mm-hmm. So when you talk about the way people transform both as performers and just as people? Like, what do you witness over the course of those six or eight weeks?
Mike Marbach: Uh, I'll do it even-- do you even better. Uh, we do an improv basics [00:18:00] workshop-
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm ...
Mike Marbach: uh, which is one day for two hours.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Sometimes an hour and a half. and the transformation over just that time is huge.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, and I don't do anything at the top, uh, to kind of, uh, bring people together. Like, before the workshop starts, um, I just kind of lead them to a room, uh, and, you know, I also kind of observe how they interact with each other, if they do at all.
Many don't. Uh, many people kind of come in looking a little nervous because they've seen improv on television, and they think that they're gonna be getting into, "Oh, I'm gonna have to, um, get up and talk about an example of the world's worst," or, "I'm gonna have to do the hoedown or some-- make up a song." Um, and that's not what we do.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: so watching them, how they interact. So the transition as they kind of get to know each other, which is an al- which is also a, uh, a huge element of all this, uh, is you are more open around people that you are more comfortable being open around. [00:19:00] Uh, the more you know each other, uh, the more trust you have.
The environment that I or our other instructors create is super important to this. , But to your, uh, question, the, the point Of where they start and where they end, uh, is a lot of times what I see, uh, is them looking at their phones w- as they wait for the workshop to start, um, maybe introducing themselves, uh, to one another and doing some of that weather talk, that surface weather talk that you, you brought up.
Um, but by the end, exchanging phone numbers, um, talking about the, the work that they do. There are p- people who have, um, gotten jobs or became friends or then signed up for the full improv one class, um, which is great. Uh, it's one of the goals of doing that, but one of the goals is also it stands on its own as a fun thing, fun thing to do.
Um, and, um, just watching that transformation for me, is, [00:20:00] you know, it's rewarding enough, uh, in, in a, in a way, because just seeing people open up. Uh, and it's in our, our feedback too, and it's over and over and over again. It's like, "I didn't know what to expect when I, when I came in, but by the end I was exchanging phone numbers."
So that's mainly what I witness, uh, is people who come into it not knowing what to expect, which is improv, making friends throughout, throughout that, two hours. Two hours. And the vibe is, is so different from the, from the very top of the workshop.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: And so you expand that to a six or eight-week class, and things are that much more cohesive.
Like I said, friendships, long friendships, 'cause I've been doing this 20 years, have come out of improv classes that I've, that I've been teaching.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, whether it's in Philly or here in Indianapolis. weddings have, have happened. Uh, so yeah, it's, uh, it just really boils down to people connecting, uh, and getting to the [00:21:00] deeper questions.
Uh, we just did, speaking of Bo Turner, um, another event, uh, with FIND, uh, FIND Indianapolis, uh, and that was a event for singles.
Michael Zarick: Mm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, for, uh, it was a show, uh, but we've also done workshops for singles. And for me, uh, that's one of the great things about improv, cause it creates a structured environment where you can meet people.
Not necessarily singles, but, any adults. Uh, because as we gr- as we get older, we-- A lot of us aren't involved in, you know, intramural sports, uh, or our, our hobbies aren't ones maybe that are around other people, or maybe we're not in a book club. Uh, so it provides a structured way where you can meet people if you're new in town or just wanna expand your circle of friends.
But for the, singles events, you get to know people very quickly in a structured way. We do one exercise where you tell a one-minute story, [00:22:00] uh, and then that person that you're telling that story to is listening. Mm-hmm. Uh, and then their, job is to then repeat that story back to you, trying to do what they can to capture the essence of how you told it.
Mm-hmm. Not like in a Jimmy Fallon impression kind of way, but what were the moments that person was excited about? What were the moments where that person's attitude kind of changed, or you saw, like, a frown or, or anything like that? You're trying to capture that. 'Cause it also opens up how you present yourself to other people as well.
But yeah, by the, end of those kinds of workshops, you know people a hell of a lot better, uh, and connect on a deeper level, whether you are interested romantically or, or not. uh, you, you have people that you know better than a first date might, uh, provide. Um, so yeah. All fun stuff and cool transformations.
Michael Zarick: f- I'm, yeah, I'm failing. Yeah, you left me speechless. I'm failing at my own improv right now. The, um [00:23:00] Oh, I was thinking about how I have done an activity like you described where you tell a story for a minute and then you repeat it back, but in a totally different context. It was actually in the context of yoga, which Oh,
Mike Marbach: okay.
Michael Zarick: But very much into terms... Well, because you talk about the improv being focused on what, what I would consider active listening, um, that's like a very active listening exercise where it's like you are... Because you're required or told ahead of time you have to repeat it back, you are obviously hyper-fixated on that.
Mm-hmm. Um, and it means you can't, uh, break out of that, that shell of like wanting to speak up or anything like
Mike Marbach: that. Oh,
Michael Zarick: for sure. Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: and I found it really pleasant in the, the one time I did it.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. And, and just like with any- anything, uh, there's going to be some aspects where you gravitate toward them.
Y- they, they come on a little bit more easy. Like there's, there... If we're talking about a performance kind of class where we have, we're miming, you know, uh, or there's another class where people are [00:24:00] doing some character work, some people gravitate, and really naturally do voices or characters or are just generally good actors.
Uh, some people are just naturally, it doesn't matter what they say, it's going to be funny, or it's going to just add information, um, even if it's not funny. Uh, people... There's skill levels, for each and every single element, just like there is with anything else.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. I, I think it's interesting how much you...
Hyper-fixate sounds negative, but that's what I'm gonna say. Hyper-fixate on this idea of interpersonal relationships through the context of improv.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: why do you think that someone like me, who I would consider a very average person, only sees improv and then thinks of comedy and then also thinks that's a little cringe and, you know- Mm-hmm
that type of thing, where it's like how- Yeah ... how has it, how has it gotten to the point where the view- the [00:25:00] average viewer thinks it's a little like odd or strange, um, versus when you speak about it, you speak about it with a, a, a pseudo reverence. And I also have found, a lot of respect for this just, again, going back to this idea of through the podcast, like I really think what you're doing is amazing.
Mm-hmm ... but what do you think about just like the average person's, uh, viewpoint?
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Uh, that viewpoint is created by Whose Line Is It Anyway?
Michael Zarick: Ugh.
Mike Marbach: Uh, which is-
Michael Zarick: An amazing show ...
Mike Marbach: which is really, really fun. Mm-hmm. But it's also a short form improv game, uh, short form improv show that is edited down.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, so it makes people think that, "Oh, I could never do that." Um, you can. You can do that, um, if you wanted to.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, and as- just as you train with something, you know- Uh, y- it's like watching the Olympics and someone is, like, hurdling. Uh, oh, I could never do that. You can if you started training at 10 like this person did, you know?
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Uh, so watching-- I think that's one element, is seeing [00:26:00] professionals do it, uh, in a way that is, uh, edited down to, like, the best stuff, uh, creates the illusion that You can't. You know, that like, oh- Yeah ... leave it to the professionals kind of thing. Um, and to some extent that s- still can be true. Uh, but there's also the fact that over the last 20, 25 years, improvisers are in a whole bunch of writers' rooms. Improvisers are on television. Improvisers are in movies. Sketch comedians are creating some of the biggest horror hits, uh, between Backrooms and Obsession-
Michael Zarick: Yeah ...
Mike Marbach: um, that have been out in a very long time. But, uh, when they then write improv scenes into their shows or their films, it's terrible. The, they write it to be terrible.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: They write it to be corny. , So they're... Which is fun, you know, but it happens repeatedly. [00:27:00] Uh, whether it is, "The Office" where, you know, Steve Carell, started in improv and came up through Second City, um, whether that's the case, or, "Abbott Elementary," with Quinta. They're, they're writing improv, uh, scenes that are...
They, they, they make it look ba- like they, it's even made fun of in the show.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um-
Michael Zarick: So like they're... But it's, they're intentionally writing bad improv- Yes ... into the show, so by way of thought versus fact-
Mike Marbach: Yes ...
Michael Zarick: to pull that back in- Mm-hmm ... you, we have now perceived it as- Yes ... sort of like goofy cringe.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
This is, this is going to be, Oh, I, I've seen improv, and I, I know what improv is. Uh, and it stinks. You know, and it's, it's, it's not something... It's either like, "Oh, I could never do that because I've seen it done so well," or, "I would never do that because I've seen it done so badly."
Michael Zarick: Mm.
Mike Marbach: Um, and I think that's, I think that hits your, your question.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um, the, the weird thing is, uh, there's, two, there's, there are good representations of [00:28:00] improv, and some of the... One of the recent ones is this movie, uh, called "Deep Cover." It's on Amazon Prime. Uh, and it is, uh, has to do with the police bringing in improv, , performers to act as like the under, the seedy underbelly of the crime world to kind of infiltrate.
It's comedy. And it's goofy, and it has, it's, it's completely ridiculous at times. But they present how the skills of improv are useful. Of course, it's a, a grand kind of outlandish scenario, but they show, you know, character work in action. They show listening. Uh, they show looking for patterns and recognizing patterns.
And then there's also this show on Netflix called "The Brother's Sun"- Which is a martial arts, uh, it's also another crime drama. I don't know what the deal with bringing improvisers in to work with crime. Um, but it's another one where that kind of plays into things, and it shows again how this guy, who's [00:29:00] going through, I think, the Groundlings school in LA in this sh- in this series, uh, how he uses improv to help his family survive you know, to get out of jams.
Uh, weird, fun things like that.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um, it's like, "What would I do if I, if this were an improv scene?" And, you know, kind of like plays it out.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: It's fun.
Michael Zarick: I had a couple of friends in high school... I probably mentioned this to you when we first got coffee, but I had a couple of friends in high school, um, shout out to Graham Cody, if you're listening.
Yeah. Um, but he, um, in high school, just like they started their own improv group, like in the high school.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: Uh, and I would go to their shows like once a month, and I always thought they were like wonderful. Like, you know, I was 17, 18, but like it was cool to like see them.
I, I would always come out of it laughing. That brings me to my next question. If you take the... You've talked about improv in the context of, you know, self-improvement, a lot of sort [00:30:00] of confidence, angle. Mm-hmm. Is, if you take it at its base level, is the goal of improv to make you laugh? Or is it just to be able to go with the flow.
Mike Marbach: I think the, the goal is what you make it. For me, the overall goal of improv, is, uh, this is gonna sound super corny, uh- Probably not ... but to make people better.
Michael Zarick: Mm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, to make better people. Because I really truly believe that if you adapt the skills of, of improv, which is listening to each other, communicating better, uh, like I was talking about before, looking for patterns, recognizing patterns, deeper listening, uh, conflict resolution, collaboration, being more positive about your own outlook- Mm-hmm
uh, being more positive and raising up your, the people around you, hearing a, hearing an issue, and trying to think through solutions with other people rather than ruminating on it, and, "Oh, we're lost. [00:31:00] It's done. It's finished." Um, finding ways through. Uh, so I, I think that for me, it's, like I said, creating better people, uh, making people better.
But that also has its own kind of, uh, goals, uh, and you can do that on stage by people coming and s- and watching your, watching your show. Because with a-- You can't rewind, uh, the stage, right? Uh, which is one of the th- one of the great things about live theater. You're gonna have people who are looking at their phones, um, but they can't, they can't be like, "Wait, what, what was it?"
We're paused. but they're, for the most part, gonna be paying attention. They're not gonna be looking at their phones. They're gonna be laughing, and it's an experience, uh, that is not gonna happen again. Uh, it's, uh, whether it's short form or long form improv or even dramatic improv, which, um, does exist, uh, you're creating something.
These people are there, and it's [00:32:00] never gonna be seen again, and they're paying to see you, and you have no idea what you're gonna do. You know, it's something, um, uh, kind of, uh, funny about that. Uh, but yeah. It's, uh, those, those are the goals. Um, make better people, uh, and I think, um, uh, make better people when they come to the, the show.
Make people better when they come to, come to see a show- Yeah ... and just forget about, forget about life for a while. Yeah.
Michael Zarick: The, the two things that pop in my head, um, are that I was thinking of James Bond
Mike Marbach: As we do.
Michael Zarick: James Bond as like, if you look at him in his, uh, if you assume this is like the coolest guy on Earth-
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm
Michael Zarick: supposedly. You know, I feel like a lot of the actions he takes, even though it's obviously a scripted movie or whatever, but a lot of the actions he takes as a spy are through the lens of improv. Like very, um, like, "Oh, I'm a loose cannon. Like I'll just do... You know, I don't need to listen to M or the dispatcher or whatever.
[00:33:00] Uh, I'm just gonna do what I think is appropriate in this moment." Thinking about that. I don't know why that popped in my head.
Mike Marbach: Uh, well, I mean, it's an opportunity for me to, unburden myself. I have not seen a single James Bond film.
Michael Zarick: Unburden.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: I'm now free. Yes.
Mike Marbach: Yes. I've been, I've been holding that in.
Not... I just haven't made the, the time. It's not that I don't- Yeah ... I don't want to. It's just that now that like I'm... And it's probably an ADHD thing- ... uh, where I would want to watch all of them. Um,
Michael Zarick: and- Is there a movie that has been written... Uh, like wasn't Anchorman like a lot of totally improvised scenes?
Mike Marbach: I'm sure.
Michael Zarick: They just like set- Yeah ... like you said, set up a base reality. We're gonna go do a, a, a brawl in the middle of the alley with the different news channels. But like what is actually said or done in that scene is a little like, you know.
Mike Marbach: I think a lot of the, the different takes, I think the scenes are probably a little bit more fleshed out than they may appear.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, because they're also good comedians- Yeah ... uh, [00:34:00] and performers that they can make it seem a little bit more fresh. Um, but they would have those like line-o-rama kinds of, kinds of things on- Mm. You know, remember DVDs?
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Rest in peace.
Mike Marbach: Um, uh, for directors. Uh, no, no, no rest... They're still made.
Michael Zarick: Oh,
Mike Marbach: that's true.
They're still made. I actually picked up two, especially 'cause, uh, companies are phasing out a lot of physical, physical media.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, I picked up-
Michael Zarick: Oh, shout out to Sony. Have you heard that news?
Mike Marbach: I did.
Michael Zarick: Okay.
Mike Marbach: I did. Uh, I picked up Weapons and, what the hell was the other one? Uh, oh, Sinners-
Michael Zarick: Mm ...
Mike Marbach: on actual physical, physical discs.
Michael Zarick: Yeah, both good movies.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Um- What are we talking about?
Michael Zarick: I don't know, whatever. We're improvising.
Mike Marbach: yeah. I threw myself, uh, right off there. Uh, not even using my own skills.
Michael Zarick: The other thing I was thinking about is that every now and then on Reddit, or just in real life, you know, th- this is something we think about, is that you I think everyone struggles with this, which is [00:35:00] like, oh, you like someone, uh, both in a romantic sense or whatever, and you, like, don't, you don't know.
Um, and you talked about, like, being able to read signals, read signs.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, uh, we do-- I, I think we do create people, um, who are better listeners. People who are better able to read body language. Um, but we don't create mind readers.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: And this, I told people this in Improv 1 today, uh, don't be stingy with your information.
Uh, don't be coy. And those are things that, of course, are going to be in, uh, not just romantic relationships, but any kind of, uh, relationship, whether it's, um, you know, a boss and a, uh, employee, uh, or, you know, lovers, um, lovers, uh, whatever it might, uh, it might be. Uh, so it still requires that people be clear with intentions and open and honest.
Uh, so does miscommunication, especially in a romantic sense, continue, because of [00:36:00] the feelings that are involved there? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So you have to still be, um... You might think that you've read something perfect, um, but, uh, maybe not.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: People just gotta talk.
Michael Zarick: One last question, and then we'll move on to what I call the canned questions.
Mike Marbach: Sure.
Michael Zarick: Is there, like, media that you-- Well, you mentioned two movies earlier.
Mike Marbach: Mm.
Michael Zarick: The Amazon Prime one and the other one. Um, is there media that you would suggest people seek out that highlights this work well?
Mike Marbach: Hmm. Uh, that highlights improv comedy, sure.
Michael Zarick: Improv anything.
Mike Marbach: Um, I don't know of anything that highlights the work of improv.
there's a, a Mike Birbiglia movie.
Michael Zarick: Hmm. God, he's so funny.
Mike Marbach: Uh, he is. He's great. there is, uh, yeah, "The Deep Cover." Uh, there's "The Brother's Son." There's, uh, on Netflix, there's a couple things. Uh, there's, , what is the name of it? Uh, Middleditch and Schwartz. Uh, [00:37:00] Schwartz being, um, uh, "Parks and Rec," Jean Ralphio.
Michael Zarick: Hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, uh, and Thomas Middleditch, uh, from the, from Silicon Valley, um, and other stuff.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, they do improv. It's just the two of them. Okay. They play a bunch of different characters, and it's really, it's overall pretty good. Um, there's, uh, Will Arnett's show, Murderville, where he is a detective, and he kind of knows the broad strokes of what's going on, but he invites in a celebrity guest.
and the celebrity guest doesn't know.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: And Will Arnett has to improvise everything along and lead them, lead them but also follow as, as this thing goes on. Uh, and they're trying to solve a crime.
Michael Zarick: I'm laughing 'cause that just sounds, that sounds absurd to me.
Mike Marbach: It is. It is quite absurd. Um, and some of the people that you wouldn't expect, uh, to be very good at this, um, uh, like an athlete, you know, you think, uh, a lot of times, uh, that they're gonna be [00:38:00] a little bit more rigid, uh, and disciplined.
but there's a, a couple that show up on the, on the series that are just really good.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: And I think it just goes back to what we were talking about earlier, and that's just play, their sense of play and pretend, you know? And their imagination is, uh, has clearly survived adulthood.
Michael Zarick: Hmm. another question popped in my head, which is what do you think of Dropout TV?
Mike Marbach: It's great.
Michael Zarick: Yeah? Yeah. I've never watched a single show- Mm ... but I am aware of it.
Mike Marbach: Super fun. a lot of great improvisers on there.
Michael Zarick: Mm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, not for nothing, uh, but some of them I trained when they were starting out, so-
Michael Zarick: Yo. Hey, I'm, I'm point- like, you can't-- If you're listening, you can't see, but I'm pointing.
This is, uh...
Mike Marbach: Um, yeah. Uh, so they're, they're, they're pretty, pretty great.
Michael Zarick: Okay, cool. I, I, I've been thinking about, like, checking that out more 'cause, um, Brennan Lee Mulligan's come across my radar a lot more recently. Mm. And, um, what's the name of the CEO? Do you know?
Mike Marbach: I don't remember, no.
Michael Zarick: Oh, gosh. Well, that guy seemed cool, [00:39:00] too.
Yeah. Um, he went on a, an interview show I like, and they-- I thought the interview he gave was really delightful.
Mike Marbach: I follow him, but I cannot remember his name right now.
Michael Zarick: I got no idea.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: Uh, we're gonna move on to what I call the canned questions.
Mike Marbach: All righty.
Michael Zarick: Third Space Indy is brought to you by City Rising.
City Rising is a social impact studio. Most recently, they implemented an eviction data dashboard that looks to highlight and reduce the impact of the over 30,000 evictions, mostly affecting Black and Latina women and their children Indianapolis faces every year. You can learn more at cityrising.org.
I have looked at that da- uh, dashboard. It is very interesting, um, just as a side note City Rising has sponsored a question
Mike Marbach: All right
Michael Zarick: Which is, what is a third space to you?
Mike Marbach: this probably sounds like a cheat, but what you described at the beginning. Sure. I mean, it's kind of what we do. It's on our, it's on our website too, trying to give people back that space that is not home, uh, that is [00:40:00] not work-
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm
Mike Marbach: uh, that is not-- or school, uh, but somewhere where they can go and, uh, connect with other people and either find or be themselves.
Michael Zarick: Mm.
Mike Marbach: Um, and forget the worries of the, the world, uh, for, for a little bit of time.
Michael Zarick: Let me ask you an extension of this then. Sure. What d- what does it mean to be yourself?
Mike Marbach: Uh, comfortable.
Michael Zarick: Mm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, I think that's what it means, uh, is just being comfortable. Uh, and you know people who go around, and they are the same person in front of everybody. Um, uh, then there are people who, um, kind of put on a different face because either they are perceiving that they have to be a certain way for a different kind of audience, um, uh, or they have to be a certain way - Yeah
for their, for that particular, uh, particular audience. So I think comfort is, is what it's all about.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Um, comfort in, uh, in your space, uh, comfort in your skin, um, [00:41:00] and I think that is kind of being, being yourself.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Do you feel like you're comfortable?
Mike Marbach: I struggle. Mm. Uh, I mean, I've been doing-- It's, it-- With improv, uh, just like with anything else, uh, you go to the gym once, uh, you're not done, you know?
Uh, you work out-
Michael Zarick: It's a
Mike Marbach: muscle. Yeah, it is. It, it is, it is a muscle, and it's your brain. we, we have a class coming up in, uh, October, uh, and I call it Work That Brain Out. Uh, and it goes, it, it kind of weaves together the, improv and science elements. Again, I am not a neuroscientist. I am just somebody who has become obsessed with it, uh, and kind of realized over reading it and, uh, over the years that a lot of what we do in improv hits on all of that s- all of that stuff.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um, but, uh, yeah, it is a, it is a muscle that has to be worked out. Teaching has, has helped. Continuing to teach, and we're, we're doing, multiple cl- uh, this session of classes, I have Improv [00:42:00] One, I teach an Improv Two, and I teach a sketch writing, sketch comedy writing class. Uh, so all of that has kind of helped to keep me a little bit more, engaged with myself and, and who, who I am.
I have to get to the point where I am performing more again. I think, uh, that will kind of, uh, reconnect that part of, that part of me. but, uh, yeah, it is, uh, I-- They combine with the ADHD, being a more i-introverted person in general. Uh, I am not the typical person who you think would be on stage making up what they're saying and doing.
but I also think that the more we do this, the more people we're seeing that it's exactly like that.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Someone said to me that, um... Two points here. Someone said to me that, uh, it was actually David Strange. Uh, he listens sometimes, I think. Uh, David Strange said, [00:43:00] "Michael, life is performance art." And I said, "Wow."
And then I said, "Third spaces are where you stop performing."
Mike Marbach: Hmm.
Michael Zarick: I don't know if you like that reply.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: But it's this idea of, um, you know, we, we put on a, a face or a mask or whatever in every, um, interaction. So I- Love it ... almost in improv, you're, like, revealing... You're t- removing the facade of, the performance by just making it, uh, known.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: If that makes sense.
Mike Marbach: Uh, well, there's a face that we wear in the cold-lighted, light of day. It's society's mask. It's society's way. You know, you
Michael Zarick: know that- No, I have
Mike Marbach: no idea ... face of Jekyll and Hyde?
Michael Zarick: Oh. I'm not
Mike Marbach: well-read enough. Jekyll and Hyde the, the musical. Uh, there's a song called "The Facade."
Michael Zarick: Hmm.
Mike Marbach: There's a face that we wear in the cold light of day. Yeah. Um, that is for maybe one person listening.
it's true. It's relevant. I wasn't just, uh, pulling that out of nowhere. But yeah, I like the, um, uh, the reply. I think it can be a, a third space, [00:44:00] um, as far as where you kind of stop, stop performing.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, depending on the space. I think that's, um, I think that's fair.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
There was another thing also that you said Oh,
Mike Marbach: was the Jekyll and Hyde, did I throw you off?
Michael Zarick: I wish I had the chops to sing. Maybe I do. Maybe I should pivot into the, like the different podcast format of just starting... Instead of doing a Jennasen song at the beginning, it should just be me.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: Every different, every episode.
Mike Marbach: But to be fair, everybody can sing.
Michael Zarick: It's ju- it's a muscle. Oh, I was talking about a muscle. I totally agree with that. In terms of like looking at the way I... Thinking of who I was back when I was a summer camp counselor, just like a freak of nature, um, able to interact with anyone, and then like ramming into the wall that was a year of no contact with anyone in 2020.
Mike Marbach: Mm.
Michael Zarick: And then like moving through time to getting to the point where I get laid off from [00:45:00] my job and then I start a podcast, to now being like annoying again, but in a way that I, I think some people like. and I, I totally agree with you. Total, total muscle, uh, behavior there of just like- It is ... needing to work out the-
Mike Marbach: It, it really is.
And again, it just goes back to the brain being, being weird. Uh, the more you don't do something, the more your brain thinks you just shouldn't do something. I, I
Michael Zarick: agree.
Mike Marbach: Um, the, the more you think, overthink something, the more you, you know, you're laying in bed and, "Oh, I should get up and do this." The more you procrastinate, the brain just kind of builds procrastination into, into things.
And there are absolutely, conditions, uh, diseases, mental, causes for a lot of this, a lot of this stuff. Uh, so I'm not saying, at all saying improv is like, "Ah, improv will cure what ails you. You know, pick it up. Only, only $199." Uh, or anything like that. Um, but I would say that it does help, um, because even with things like, you know, [00:46:00] dementia, Alzheimer's, there are improv exercises and improv studies, uh, that are, show, showed that it helps.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: When you work that brain out.
Michael Zarick: A follow-up question to the previous question. We took a long tangent, but that's okay. Uh, which is, what is a third space or place that has existed for you previously but no longer does?
Mike Marbach: Hmm. You say no longer does as in it doesn't exist, like physically, or no longer, uh, does as in I just haven't been able to do it?
Michael Zarick: so the example I always give, 'cause I think it's the easiest one, I just mentioned summer camp.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: I was a summer camp counselor from ages 17 to 21. Mm-hmm. Uh, that summer camp still exists, but I do not exist-
Mike Marbach: Mm. ...
Michael Zarick: there. Okay. So I would say it doesn't exist in that sense.
Mike Marbach: Gotcha. Yeah. Okay. Well, first of all, I too was a camp counselor.
Michael Zarick: Oh, no.
Mike Marbach: I was. That's
Michael Zarick: fucked up.
Mike Marbach: I was. Um, uh, which was, uh... It was [00:47:00] one of my favorite jobs of all time.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: I loved it. Um, and, um, so that was Camp Quora back in, back in Philly.
Michael Zarick: Quora?
Mike Marbach: Quora, yeah.
Michael Zarick: Okay, cool.
Mike Marbach: good time. Great time. I was the, uh, what, my title was, like, communications counselor. Fitting. Um, which he only hired me because I had put video editing, uh, on my application.
Um, and he told me so. Um, he's like: Hey, I'm bringing you in because we do an end of summer, uh, slideshow, but I wanna do, like, a video element this year. Um, so I'm gonna put you in this, uh, trailer, um, with some computers. Uh, and I was, like, teaching kids how to type, um, h- watching them play games, but I was also running around taking photos, uh, for the slideshow- Mm-hmm.
and editing things. And as the four-- 'cause I was there for four years, I had them doing a short film, uh, comedy sketches, like, that were written for kids, and they were acting in them, uh, that all then g- it went from a, it came from a slideshow with some video [00:48:00] elements, too, at the end. It was, like, 45 minutes long, uh, that had, um, sketches and, probably, like, a 12-minute movie in there.
Yeah. It was a little nuts. Anyway. That's
Michael Zarick: sick. Yeah. No, that's liter- that's literally so cool.
Mike Marbach: It was a good time. and, uh, so a third place for me that has, that, that doesn't exist anymore, I would say Bowling.
Michael Zarick: Hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, 'cause bowling still exists, but I do, I do not exist in bowling. Bowling was one of the places for me, it was kind of a third place where I would go there weekly, uh, growing, growing up, um, either by myself, uh, but usually with, um, to practice, um, or with, the teams.
Uh, Saturday morning team leagues. , And since college, uh, where we'd also go bowling a lot, um, I haven't really done it, and it's been a very long time since, since I have. Uh, and I think about it probably once a month at least, um, to-
Michael Zarick: Mike, why aren't you bowling?
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Yeah. And I was-- I wa- I mean, I wasn't, [00:49:00] you know, I'm not joining the PBA Tour or anything.
Um-
Michael Zarick: Have you ever hit a perfect game?
Mike Marbach: No, not at all. Okay. my highest was like 256. Hmm. Um, still pretty good.
Michael Zarick: That's pretty good.
Mike Marbach: You know, not in the, you know, sh- can, you know- I
Michael Zarick: don't think I've ever
Mike Marbach: hit- Not gonna sneeze at.
Michael Zarick: I don't think I've broken, like, 210, so.
Mike Marbach: yet.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Oh, okay.
Mike Marbach: Yet.
Michael Zarick: Well, let me get back in it.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. I mean, bowling is like... I'm, I'm one of the people that thinks it should be an Olympic sport, but also recognizes that you could just throw it down there. You know? There could be absolutely technique, but also at the same time, you can get a toddler up there and they can roll the ball and knock them all down.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um-
Michael Zarick: It's a great intergenerational space, actually. Yeah. We, we talk, I talk about- It absolutely is ... those spaces sometimes, like the roller skating rink's a, a example of that, but bowling is, like, a great thing to do with a wide variety of people. Oh, for sure.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. So bowling for me, I think, is a space, uh, a third space that I, I don't have.
I'm-- I mean, improv was the, a third space, and until we started really doing stuff here in Indy, it didn't exist, exist for me. [00:50:00] I would say it exists now, and it will kind of, like, exist more once we have more regular performances. but we're, we're getting there.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. How often do you, um- attend comedy stuff in Indy?
Mike Marbach: Not enough.
Michael Zarick: Not enough.
Mike Marbach: Uh, not enough, um, because I live on the s- on the s- blah, the south side.
Michael Zarick: Um- You live on the south side.
Mike Marbach: Yes.
Michael Zarick: For sure.
Mike Marbach: The, yeah, touching Greenwood. Um, and I don't drive.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, so when I leave the house-
Michael Zarick: Much respect to you for that, by the way.
Mike Marbach: Well, no. Uh, I mean, I thank you, I will take the respect.
But also, um, I can't go places.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Uh, yeah, that's true.
Mike Marbach: without paying. Mm-hmm. Uh, and thankfully here in Indy, Indianapolis, uh, when I take a Lyft or an Uber, it's a hell of a lot less than it would be in Philly. But also in Philly or Chicago where I lived, there are other options, and also things are a little bit more close together.
Yeah. If I really needed to walk somewhere, I could walk. Thank you for- Here, there's not even a
Michael Zarick: sidewalk ... thank you for steering us to this, 'cause this is my favorite topic. You know [00:51:00] that well.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. Uh, so, uh, that's-- I don't go to as many comedy shows as I would like. Also, first of all, uh... Oh, the first of all is I don't drive.
The second of all is there's not enough comedy shows to go to. Mm-hmm. Uh, there are sporadic things other than stand-up, um, and to some extent storytelling. there's not enough long-form improv. There's a, a lot of short-form improv, uh, in Indianapolis. There's Comedy Sports Indianapolis, uh, which does short form, but they also, uh, do more and more, uh, long form too.
Um, so they're, uh, offering more to, to see. There's Red Curb Comedy, uh, which follows Study Hall, um, once a month at the IF Theater, but there's not that much to see.
Michael Zarick: Um- Do you think that is a, um, a similar issue that live music is facing where just the, the interest isn't there. There's not a lot of [00:52:00] like, oh, if I wanna charge $10 to $25 for my show, people just won't pay and show up?
Or is there just quite literally not the infrastructure for it?
Mike Marbach: Uh, I think it's so much. Uh, it's what you said, but it's also the minimum wage in Indiana is 7.25.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Uh, the-- There is no public transit. Most-- There's, there's little to no- Yeah,
Michael Zarick: at least especially down where you live.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. There's little to no public transit.
Uh, there are... It's cheaper to stay in and scroll, or even rent, uh, than it is to, to go out. There's a whole lot of socioeconomic factors for why music is struggling. They're charging more because they can't fill stadiums a lot of times, depending on what it is, so they have to make up for, uh, that.
Um, uh, that's why you're seeing, like, subscription services, uh, for movie theaters. I remember when I was growing up, uh, a movie theater would have, like, 400 seats, and now there's, like, 40.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: 40 seats. They're nicer. They're nicer seats. Yeah,
Michael Zarick: they're [00:53:00] big, big, big cushy seats. And
Mike Marbach: you can re- you can recline.
Michael Zarick: That take up two X the
Mike Marbach: space. Um, yeah, and there's always, like, a rrr kind of, kind of noise, um, along with it. Um, but, uh, they're, they're trying to do things to, to, to bring people back because they're getting less, less people. Um, I think that, uh, there are governmental issues, uh, around, uh, grants and investing in arts.
Uh, I think Indianapolis does better than some places, um, but Indiana, uh, could be doing so much more. Uh-
Michael Zarick: I think Indiana, don't quote me on this, listeners, but I believe Indiana is, like, third
last in, like, arts investment.
Mike Marbach: Man. yeah, not much after that. Um, yeah, so, uh, there's so much more that could be, could be done because if, if there were more in the way of grant funding, you could make your show little to no cost.
you know, we have theater companies, uh, that have to, have to charge, but [00:54:00] if they were, if they had more grant funding and we were investing in the arts and all of their needs were met, because that is a skill, you know. You are, you're not just providing entertainment, you are pr- you're providing escape, uh, to people.
Laughter, you know, once again, going back to br- to the brain, uh, reduces stress. Uh, it literally lowers inflammation in the body. Like, if, uh, we as a country, uh, or as a state here in Indianapolis or a city, uh, Indianapolis, um, uh, invested more in arts, um, raised the minimum wage, uh, made tickets more affordable.
Like, there's gonna be some cases where I think I don't blame people for not going. Um, but I also Don't blame the art.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: You know? Um, it's, it's-- Or the artist. Uh, it's, it's tough.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: It's a, it's a really tough situation that is exacerbated by a bunch of [00:55:00] socioeconomic factors. Um, because if people aren't going to see a movie in the theater, um, you, you can't complain about a short theatrical run.
You can't complain about the fact that, uh, when it goes to streaming that it costs $20 to rent. When I was growing up, it was like a $1.75, and maybe two hours if I didn't rewind. Um, uh, so there's a whole lot going into it. Uh, it is not a, um... It's a very complex, complex issue.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um, that would be helped by raising the minimum wage, making shows more accessible, um, uh, transportation-wise.
Um, not just for me, 'cause I- Yeah. If there was a, if there was a train, uh, coming, uh, or an L, uh, subway from Greenwood, uh, or Southport where I'm at, uh, to right, right to downtown, uh, or up to Carmel, um, where there are other things that can be seen, I would go.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: But if I'm having [00:56:00] issue-
Michael Zarick: And you're someone who would immediately.
Mike Marbach: Oh, yeah.
Michael Zarick: You know?
Mike Marbach: Yeah, absolutely. Uh, I-- In Philly, uh, I lived the... It would be kind of like in C- uh, Carmel in north, uh, far northeast Philly. It would be like where Carmel is, um, to, to where the down- downtown is, um, for some of my time, uh, when I was involved in arts. Uh, and I would get on the bus. I would take like two buses, uh, and a train, uh, or the subway, uh, to, to get downtown.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: I eventually moved downtown, um, but, uh, I did it. Yeah, and I would. And I miss just... Uh, I mean, I get it, the experience a little bit with, um, in a Lyft or an Uber 'cause I don't have to drive and I don't have to pay attention. But also, I always feel, like, less protected in a car than I did a bus, uh, or a train-
Michael Zarick: Totally
Mike Marbach: uh, s- a subway. So I, I never, I can never fully relax, uh, in, in a Lyft or an Uber. Um, at the same time, I also, like, [00:57:00] picture myself behind the wheel. Um, and I'm like, "You're fine. You'll be okay."
Michael Zarick: That's funny.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: Uh, I have-
Mike Marbach: It's a big question is what I'm saying.
Michael Zarick: That was a great answer. So don't, don't feel any type of way Every episode, I ask a question from the previous guest.
Mike Marbach: Ooh.
Michael Zarick: Sneak peek for you The previous guest to this episode is Ben Inskeep, who is the program director of the customer... Oh, no. C- it's just CAC I'll call it. I'll call it that. Um, which is a large, uh, consumer advocacy organization. He asks, "What can you do, or what are you doing to have a positive effect in your own neighborhood?"
Mike Marbach: In my own neighborhood? Oof. a positive
Michael Zarick: effect And you don't-- You can also depersonalize it if you just wanna think about it that way.
Mike Marbach: hmm. In my own neighborhood, I mean, other [00:58:00] than, uh, keeping a lawn mowed, you know, keep that lawn, uh, from getting too bad.
Um, although there are other eyesores, uh, around, around the property. what am I doing to make it better? I would have to expand because even-- Like, my neighborhood is where I reside, but where I live, is Indianapolis. Mm-hmm. Um, and mostly in, you know, downtown-ish and expanding that a little bit. Um, but in general, where I live, uh, is, in improv, uh, and a whole bunch of people kind of coming through me.
A Crossroads, if you will, uh, coming- Dang. Tie it in. Uh, so all-- everything that we've talked about, if that's not, cheapening or chickening out of the, the question. Helping to make people-- helping people connect with themselves, connect with new people, people that are new in town, uh, to make, make connections, meet new people, have a good time, build some [00:59:00] confidence.
Because if you, you know, if we got some Indiana politicians in an improv class, if we had-- If we, if there was a rule where in order to get into politics, you had to go through an improv program, I think we would have better politicians.
Michael Zarick: That's hilarious.
Mike Marbach: Uh, it's- But I believe you ... also true. I, I 100% believe that.
Um, because how often do you see a congressional hearing where they come with their-- everybody comes with their pre-written, preconceived ideas. No one's really listening to each other. Everybody's talking over each other. Uh, and it's only the moments that break through, where people are actually listening and you get s- they, they might get somebody on a question, um, because they're pushing and listening.
They're not just saying, "Okay, let's, let's move on," like the news always, the news always does. I could go down that road, um, but, uh, it's another podcast. To the question, what am I doing to, [01:00:00] uh, make my neighborhood better? I think that is, uh, what I'm doing right now, uh, is what Crossroads does, uh, and that is helping to make people in the neighborhood, better versions of themselves.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. I think that's a perfectly valid answer. Okay. I agree with you entirely. Not necessarily... I sort of extrapolated just to people in general, not just politicians, is that a, a lot of our issues stem from a lack of listening, a lack of learning- Yeah ... a lack of communication. Um, truly. Mm-hmm. So I, I agree with you, uh, in an, in entirety.
Good. Mike, two last questions. Sure. Is there anything else you wanna talk about? Anything on your heart, on your mind? Anything you're thinking about at this time? Hmm. Any, uh, sad memories for the, the Philadelphia Phillies?
Mike Marbach: Uh, they're doing pretty good right now. Uh, Schwarber leads, uh, in home runs. Uh, we have a new manager.
Like, they came out in April, [01:01:00] um, uh, and fired, uh, Rob Thompson, um, who was their, their manager. So they're, they're, they're, they're in good shape. other than the Phillies, uh, other stuff on my mind, um, I wanna see the new "Evil Dead."
Michael Zarick: Did it come out? Or I thought it came out a couple years ago. Am I- Uh, yeah
Is there another
Mike Marbach: new one? E- e- yeah, "Evil Dead," uh, I believe it's called "Evil Dead Burn," um, is out as of this past Friday.
Michael Zarick: Are you a scary movie guy?
Mike Marbach: I love 'em.
Michael Zarick: Is-- What's the name of the... Is it "Obsession"?
Mike Marbach: Yes.
Michael Zarick: That's the one you mentioned earlier also. Mm-hmm. Is it, um... Can you describe this movie to me? Because it, for some reason it's caught my eye, but I've not watched it.
Mike Marbach: Uh, well, I mean, the best way to put it, uh, is be careful what you wish for. That's, uh, which has been done since the "Twilight Zone," right? Um, but I think they do that idea a, uh, they do it well.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: Uh, I'm enjoying sitting here talking to you about this, so I'm actually interested. Um, what is it about horror [01:02:00] movies you like?
I took a horror movie class in college, and it really changed my perspective on them. It actually made me appreciate them more. But what is it about horror movies that you like?
Mike Marbach: Uh, I like getting scared. Um- ... I like seeing if something can scare me, uh, because I've seen so many horror, horror films.
Michael Zarick: Yeah.
Mike Marbach: Um, they a lot of times are some of the more, Even when they're bad, they can still be good. Um, even if they're a little bit more paint by number, they can still be entertaining. There's always gonna be something, uh, that, um, is fun about it. Uh, uh, sometimes if they're bad, they're, they could be very funny-
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm ...
Mike Marbach: unintentionally. Um, yeah, I think it's just, I like, uh...
I was also raised on them.
Michael Zarick: Hmm.
Mike Marbach: I think that probably plays, plays into it, like my dad raising me on, uh, horror films and, um, watching things that I should not have watched- Yeah ... uh, when I was-
Michael Zarick: It's like people who listen to [01:03:00] metal. I feel like everyone who listens to metal, their parents listen to metal.
Like, no one just, like, falls into that. Yeah. At least that's what I think.
Mike Marbach: I'm making that up. Well, that's probably true. Like, I, I listen to everything that my parents listen to, and that crosses, um, blues, uh, which, still comes, still comes up. Uh, everything from, from blues to, uh, you know, things like Steppenwolf.
Barbra Streisand, like it's, it's all over. Oh, Eric Clapton. He, well, that goes back to the, the blues, but, um, yeah, I think there's something, something to that. Yeah. It's just my dad, um, was also into horror films, and I am into horror films.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. The horror movie class that I took talked about how horror movies are a reflection of the fears of whatever time they were made in.
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: Um, which I think is really interesting to think about in the context of, um... So one of the movies we watched in that movie, uh, in that class was called "Teeth," which is about- Oh, yeah ... um, a woman with- Mm-hmm ... teeth in her vagina. Yep.
Mike Marbach: Chomp.
Michael Zarick: And this idea, uh, [01:04:00] of, like, a puritanical society, um, as, like, an overwhelming force.
But you mentioned "Obsession" and "Backrooms," which is a reflection of, uh, Gen Z's fears of being perceived and, this fear of being a simulacrum of yourself sort of- Yeah ... type thing. Like, this idea of, I don't know exactly what "Obsession's" about necessarily, but, uh, this idea of just, like, perception and sort of the way the world views you I think is really interesting.
Mike Marbach: Yeah. I think there's, uh, something to that for, for sure. Yeah. Uh, I also think that it's very easy after the fact, uh, to say, like, "Oh, this is-" "This, this was a metaphor for- Yeah. Yeah ... for this or that or the other thing," whereas, like, you know, comedy not necessarily. Um, uh, it's gonna be a little bit more in your face.
Um, but, uh, with horror, where you're using a lot of, um, you know, monsters or tension or whatever it might be, what [01:05:00] is this a... What does this rep- represent in the real world? oh, it represents society's reluctance, uh, you know, whatever might, it might be, um, is easy to attach after the fact. And I think in that way, horror is art.
Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
Mike Marbach: Or it's like it can be very- Totally ... it can be very subjective, uh, in that way and what people see in it in a way that, you know, Steven Seagal's, um, uh, uh, what's it? "Under, Under Fire," whatever the hell that movie- Yeah. ... was. Uh, "Down Below." Uh, what, uh, they all sound like Steven- You- ... Steven Seagal movies.
They might not be.
Michael Zarick: You could say any set of, like, two words and it would sound like a Steven Seagal movie.
Mike Marbach: Yeah, right? Um, yeah. "Fire Down Below," maybe that's what... That was the... what I'm thinking of. Anyway, but, uh, yeah, I think that the... it's, there's a subjectivity to it. Uh, so I think that's, that's all, correct.
Michael Zarick: Yeah. Okay. Thank you for sharing.
Mike Marbach: Mm-hmm.
Michael Zarick: One last question, which is- Yep ... what question would you like to ask the next [01:06:00] Third Space Indy guest?
Mike Marbach: Ooh. Mm.
Michael Zarick: It can be anything. It doesn't have to be, uh... It can be absurdist or weird or- Um- ... normal. I don't know.
Mike Marbach: What is something from another city that they do really well that you would like to see Indy, Indianapolis adopt?
Michael Zarick: What is something from another city that you think they do well that you would like to see Indianapolis adopt?
Mike Marbach: Yeah.
Michael Zarick: That is the question.
Mike Marbach: It is.
Michael Zarick: All right. Well, thank you so much for coming on, Mike Marbach.
Mike Marbach: Thank you.
Michael Zarick: If you would like to be found, will you t- uh, tell the people where they can find you?
Mike Marbach: Yes.
You can follow us, uh, on social media, Instagram @xroadscomedyindy.
Michael Zarick: And that's X. Yes.
Mike Marbach: The letter X. The letter X. Uh, Xroadscomedyindy, and that is on Instagram and Facebook. Uh, you can go [01:07:00] to xroadscomedyindy.com for our information, uh, on classes, shows, uh, corporate training events, uh, private shows, a whole bunch of, uh, stuff.
Michael Zarick: Dope. And yeah, if you're ever feeling like you, I don't know. If you ever feel like you're lacking self-confidence or you'd like to be able to dance around a conversation, I don't know what I'm doing. Um-
Mike Marbach: You're getting
Michael Zarick: jiggy with it ... then yeah, check out, uh, Crossroads Comedy 'cause I think he does good work.
Uh, anyways, thank you so much for watching or listening to this episode of Third Space Indy. You can find me by going to thirdspaceindy.com or by going to @thirdspaceindy on Instagram
Thank you so much to City Rising for sponsoring the podcast. And as always, thank you so much to the local artist Jennasen for allowing me to use your song Scared Rabbit as the intro music, to the podcast. Thank you once again for watching, and thank you so much for Mike for coming on. See you in the [01:08:00] next one.
Goodbye.
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