Bonus Episode - Proof: A Midwest Lit Fest 2025
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Intro
No super big fanfare here. I was invited to Proof: A Midwest Lit Fest, an event thrown by Indiana Humanities.
I suspect this is the first of a number of bonus episodes. I actually crave to put together more content like this because it satiates my desire to share more about the city.
I had a great time at Proof and am really looking forward to next year, where I’ll hopefully have time to sit and enjoy some of the talks/activities and maybe talk to some folks that are not business owners 😂.
All links to all the folks I talked to are below!
Can be found here:
Links to listen
Links of references from the show
Production learnings
Story Time
Episode Summary
Episode Transcript
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Important links and mentions
Production learnings from the episode
Big shout-out to Anna Darling for joining me about halfway through the day and being my camera operator. Appreciate you always.
Third Space Indy is supported by City Rising
Episode Summary
Exploring the Midwest Lit Fest: Conversations with Indianapolis' Literary Community
Michael Zarick, host of Third Space Indy, is invited by Indiana Humanities to Proof: A Midwest Lit Fest at the Harrison Center, Indianapolis. He engages in insightful discussions with various figures from the local literary scene, including bookstore owners, writers, and volunteers. Key conversations highlight the vibrant literary community, the importance of mutual support among local businesses, and the transformative power of literacy. Guests share their experiences and the impact of events like Proof in fostering a literary hub in Indianapolis. The episode underscores the potential for community-building and cultural enrichment through literary engagement.
00:00 Welcome to Third Space Indy
00:51 Introducing Jake Budler
02:00 The Essence of Proof: A Midwest Lit Fest
06:33 Sara from Golden Hour Books
11:25 Elysia from Irvington Books and Vinyl
17:19 Dr. Adam Henze on Indianapolis Literary Scene
21:39 Keauan Michael Brown of Ujaama Books
26:46 The Joy of Storytelling
27:03 Shoutouts and Local Highlights
27:44 Interview with Indiana Humanities
33:15 Paws & Think: Reading to Dogs
36:39 Ray Bradbury Center Insights
43:02 Kid's Ink Books: A New Chapter
47:16 Each Other's Books: A Friendship Story
51:33 Indy Reads: Literacy and Community
56:14 Conclusion
Episode Transcript
PROOF: Midwest Lit Fest
[00:00:00] Michael Zarick: Hi. My name is Michael Zarick and I'm the host of Third Space Indy Um, Indiana Humanities invited me to their event proof, a Midwest Lit Fest right here at the Harrison Center and the surrounding area, including. A couple of different buildings and, uh, businesses. this is a, an event where people who are writers, readers, people who are interested in literacy and all types of surrounding humanities, come to share their mutual love for that type of stuff.
So I'm gonna sit here, walk around, have some conversations, and find out a little bit about the community surrounding this Midwest Lit Fest.
[00:00:51] Michael Zarick: Hey, uh, I'm here with my very brand new friend, Jake Budler Wait, are we camera lookers? Uh, we can be. How intensely? I don't normally look at the camera. All right, great. Okay. Like, it kind of scares me. I feel like I'm staring into
someone's soul. Uh, so Jake, can you tell me who you are
real quick?
[00:01:07] Jake Budler: Uh, my name's Jake. I am a co-owner of Tomorrow
Bookstore. I ride my bike around Indy and I
like to have fun. Hmm.
[00:01:15] Michael Zarick: Uh, real quick, would you say that injuring your leg. A couple months ago, or a couple, I don't know, however long ago, uh, increased your ability, 14.5 weeks. Who's tracking who's, who's tracking?
Would you say it increased your, uh, ability
to read or did it? Huh? Did it just make you bummed out?
[00:01:34] Jake Budler: Yeah, no correlation. Unfortunately, if, if anything, I've been reading less recently and not because of anything, but because doing rehab and PT takes like an hour to an hour and a half of time every day, and it's so irritating.
So it's decreased by, and you have the like, ability to read, actually cancel everything to go do that too. Yeah. Yeah. To drive to Carmel once a week. And Carmel, I can't say that's my favorite part of the week. That's all.
[00:02:00] Michael Zarick: Um, so we are here at
proof, as you can see with the balloons we just fixed. And by we, I mean you uh, can you tell me what it means to have a literary festival right here in the middle of Indianapolis?
[00:02:12] Jake Budler: Uh, if you can see my view, which you cannot because of the camera, uh, this is why. This is a room full of bookstores, publishers, authors, readers, the, this is the community in one room, and that's what proof does. Um, you know, it, it is the, this is the second year that proof is happening. It is, um, founded by two local authors, poets, uh, Chantel Massey and Mitchell Douglas, and then Indiana Humanities organizes it with the support of bookstores.
Um, and so this is the second year. It's phenomenal like this It's in the name and it's supposed to be in the name. This is the proof. Uh, and I think that this is, this is the goal.
Yeah. Ah, a little on the nose, but it's, you know, it's supposed to be amazing. this is like, This is proof of. The literary community, like that's what it's supposed to be. But to me there's a broader point too of like, this is proof of what you can do in Indianapolis.
If you want to, you can build things, you can create things, you can create a community. Um, you can bring people together around an interest or thing that you want to do. And I think we have the space and the ability to do that, um, in a, in a broader
sense. And so, like, you know, two, two poets were like, we want to, you know, we wanna do a Midwest Lit Festival and Indiana Humanities credit to them because they are incredibly.
Hardworking, entrepreneurial, you know, they're, they're yes people, which I, I love, I, I try to operate like that too. And they're like, you know, let's, let's do it. And I mean, behind the scenes here, there's a, an awesome team of volunteers, but it, you know, it's, it's a small team and they
do other things and have full-time jobs doing other things across the state.
Um, and for the people, you know, behind this to come together, put a bunch of energy behind this and have an incredibly successful event as well. Is, is proof of Indianapolis working like it should.
[00:03:49] Michael Zarick: Amazing. Uh, there's a, there's a common turn of phrase that I like to use is just like, you can just do things.
Yeah. You can just do things no matter what. you did this and
[00:03:56] Jake Budler: I, yeah, I mean, that's like, you know, people ask us about Tomorrow Bookstore like, oh, is this your dream? And, you know, you planned this forever. And I was like, not really. Uh, we're in Chicago. It like,
[00:04:04] Michael Zarick: came together in like, like less than a year. In a weird way.
[00:04:07] Jake Budler: We signed a lease, so we, we started joking about opening a bookstore in August and we signed a lease in January. Uh, which I don't think that's very common. No, it's not. And I wouldn't, and I wouldn't really recommend that. Like, and I wouldn't tell people that that's
a normal thing, you know, but there's also some threads there of like, you know, we, we met Tom and then Ed Battista really quickly, and we, you know, we were talking about another space and it, like, it, it came together in a way incredibly quickly.
Not because necessarily of us and what we wanted to do, but because of the people around us as well. And like, so there's credit to the community. And people who gave us a chance and gave us an opportunity, uh, in a way that, you know, doesn't happen everywhere. So, um, you know, I think that, like, that's one example of this, but if you, you know, if you want to do, a friend of mine was just making a joke about this, like, if you wanna do underwater basket weaving, like you could probably find three people and do that.
Right? Like, that might not be in a pool, a huge community pool. Yeah. But like, you could do it. You know what, CCIC now? Factory Arts Farts. District Farts. Take that off. Whatever. It's fine. No, I call. That the, only, the, the, I love it. I'm so glad they're doing a great job. Like it's an amazing location. The one thing that makes me so sad is there were like three guys that would go out and practice hurling against the
wall that is now gone.
You know what hurling is?
[00:05:30] Michael Zarick: like like
throwing the ball ex. Exactly. Or it's the, it's like the, an Irish thing. It's the very niche Irish game.
[00:05:35] Jake Budler: And there's like three guys. It was like the Indianapolis Hurling Club. stopped on my bike one time. I was like, like, I know what you're doing, but what the hell? Like, why are you doing this and tell me about it. And of course, it's the Indianapolis Hurling Club or whatever it was called. And like, that was their thing. And I was like, no, I gotta go find another wall. Okay. But, um, you know, point of like that all the way to like a, a literary festival, like what is your, what do you want to do? What do you want to build?
And you can
go out and do it, and you don't need a lot of money to do it necessarily. Banger.
[00:06:02] Michael Zarick: I know if I sit here and keep talking to you, we're gonna talk forever. So I'm gonna cut you off then I'm gonna, and
[00:06:06] Jake Budler: then I'm gonna say things I'll get in trouble for.
[00:06:08] Michael Zarick: I'm gonna, actually, not really, this will be a fun thing to do.
Who should I go to next?
[00:06:13] Jake Budler: Who am I to seas? I mean, go talk to
Sara when she's done talking to people. Sara. Sara runs golden hour books. Oh, okay. Sara has taste, actually her, she's down the street from me. Sara's wonderful, um, incredible taste. Ask her about music. I need to ask her about music and books. That's who I would talk to next, but she's talking to someone.
So who else would I talk to?
[00:06:30] Michael Zarick: No, don't gimme more than one.
[00:06:31] Jake Budler: yeah. Yeah, Start. Yeah, I'll introduce
[00:06:32] Michael Zarick: you. Only get one pick.
I'm standing with Sara
from Golden Hour Books. Right. On College Avenue, right? Yeah, that's right. Uh, and I have lived down the street from you now. I just talked to Jake Butler. Yeah. And he said that you have great music taste. I,
[00:06:47] Sara Somers: I kind of do. Yeah. What are you
[00:06:48] Michael Zarick: listening to right now?
Um, always
[00:06:50] Sara Somers: Sharon Van Etten.
Um, who? Sharon Van Etten. She was just here. She was just, um, at the Hi-Fi dun in Fountain Square. Okay. Um, she's a genius. Um. I'm always listening to John Cale and older stuff. Um, yeah, I don't know. I, I am not maybe up to date on like what the young folks are listening to.
[00:07:13] Michael Zarick: The young, how old are you?
[00:07:15] Sara Somers: 42. Yeah.
[00:07:16] Michael Zarick: Okay. Okay. Okay.
[00:07:18] Sara Somers: I'm, I'm in that stage where it's like, oh, is that still young? I don't know. I don't know.
[00:07:22] Michael Zarick: Um, what about local music? Are there any local musicians you really enjoy?
[00:07:27] Sara Somers: Uh, that's my, not my area of expertise. Ooh. I know, I know. My friends at Luna Music are gonna have my head for that. Yeah. That's
[00:07:33] Michael Zarick: all good.
Um, so we're here at Midwest Lit Fest. Yeah. Can you tell me what it means to you to be able to have this event with a shared space with other booksellers Sure. Other authors, writers.
[00:07:44] Sara Somers: Yeah.
[00:07:44] Michael Zarick: Things like that.
[00:07:45] Sara Somers: I mean, I think what Proof is trying to do. Uh, is similar to what we're all working toward, which is making Indianapolis a bigger literary center.
Right? I mean, we've always had literary livelihood here, but I think now it's getting to the point where there's enough bookstores, there's enough non-profits that everyone's trying to gather together to be like, Hey, we are a city. That has a presence. Yeah. And like, let's actually celebrate that.
Definitely. Let's definitely make some people aware that may not be
[00:08:19] Michael Zarick: amazing. Yeah. Uh, one thing that I hear a lot is that a lot of the local bookstores specialize in certain things. What would you say your specialty is?
[00:08:29] Sara Somers: Um, so we specialize in all new books. We're a general interest store, but I would say that we have a, a focus on literary fiction, nonfiction, poetry.
Um, we have an entire room for children. Um, but really just like the books that may not be hitting your algorithm, so things that are a little bit under the radar. Um, a lot of European stuff, a lot of, uh, fiction and translation, a lot of feminist lit. Um, so yeah, I think we cater toward. Just really high quality, beautiful books that we know to be good and that we love to recommend to people.
[00:09:08] Michael Zarick: Definitely. And I want to give a shout out to Megan Jefferson.
[00:09:12] Sara Somers: Yeah.
[00:09:12] Michael Zarick: Uh, when I first moved here and I first started this podcast, uh, I talked to Megan Jefferson. She was my very first guest, and I was like, oh, where should I go around town? And she gave you all the shout. Oh, sweet. Yeah. Yeah. I love
[00:09:23] Sara Somers: that.
[00:09:23] Michael Zarick: Uh, but I'm not that big of a reader, so I haven't come in that much.
I'm trying to, I'm trying to fix it. I'm trying to fix it. Um. Well, yeah. Uh, what are you reading right now?
[00:09:34] Sara Somers: Um, so can I like grab something? I don't care. Yeah, yeah, do what do you want? Yeah. So, um, this book I just finished, uh, Ayşegül Savaş is a Turkish writer who lives in Paris. Wait, can
[00:09:48] Michael Zarick: you say that so I can hear it?
[00:09:49] Sara Somers: Uh, I think Ayşegül Savaş. That's
[00:09:52] Michael Zarick: a name.
[00:09:53] Sara Somers: I have looked it up the pronunciation before and forget it. Um, but she is the author of the Anthropologist, which we have over there, which is a novel. This is Short Stories. Um, she's got like four or five books of varying lengths. She is crisp, clean. Um, she is just writing in a way that I don't see a lot of folks writing.
Um, I want to read every single thing that she writes, um, her grocery list. Like I, I want, I want everything that she has touched.
[00:10:25] Michael Zarick: That's high praise.
[00:10:26] Sara Somers: Yeah, I, I mean, I, I immediately read her and was like, okay, I have been looking for you. Uh, this is, this is where I am right now.
[00:10:36] Michael Zarick: Are you familiar with, uh, the concept of, are you familiar with Kurt Vonnegut, obviously?
Yeah. Yeah. Uh, do you know a a karass like that outer worldly connection that you feel to somebody? Oh, sure. Yes. Yes. Similar, yeah.
[00:10:50] Sara Somers: I feel like I do have this, like, this relationship to her writing immediately upon viewing, I'm just like, oh, you are seeing something that I am seeing.
[00:10:59] Michael Zarick: Definitely. Yeah. Amazing. Well, thank you for sharing. Yeah, of course. Uh, just a little snippet. Maybe we'll connect again later. Yeah. But who should I go to next?
[00:11:09] Sara Somers: In here?
[00:11:10] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Or I don't know, anywhere. If you know someone somewhere else, I was
[00:11:13] Sara Somers: like, go to go to Foundry and get me another coffee. Um, no. Uh, go to Irvington books and vinyl.
Okay. Elysia, I know a
[00:11:20] Michael Zarick: little bit about her. Yeah,
[00:11:21] Sara Somers: she's great.
[00:11:22] Elysia Lucinda: I talk into this.
[00:11:23] Michael Zarick: You do
talk into that. Great.
Hey, uh, I'm here with Elysia irvington in books. I have yet to go to Irvington, but I do know you, as you
said, in a parasocial way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Purely through
Instagram. Uh, you regularly do tarot readings if you come in and buy a book. Can you tell me where you found your passion for tarot?
[00:11:43] Elysia Lucinda: Um, I started reading tarot cards when I was like 16. Um, and
I actually, it's one of those things when I first opened the store, um, you kind of gotta be, un held down
by your own stress and anxiety in order to do a good job at it. And so when I first opened the store, I
never read tarot for anyone. I just started doing it public facing. Maybe two years ago. Mm-hmm. Um, because every time I would pull cards, I would just pull
my own shit. You know? I would just pull whatever was going on in my life because it was so potent. 'cause I was so stressed out all the time, you know?
Yeah. Um, but now that I'm doing it for people, I'm like walking around being like I'm a psychic. You know? Um, and I definitely get a lot of information, but, you
know, people freak out if you tell them you're a psychic.
[00:12:27] Michael Zarick: That's fun. Maybe I'll
come in and get one.
[00:12:29] Elysia Lucinda: Please. You'd be shocked what I can tell you.
[00:12:33] Michael Zarick: I actually got my tarot reading very recently, and the thing that happened was Very uh. Very otherworldly in a, in a weird way. So, do you
[00:12:41] Elysia Lucinda: know who read your tarot? Do you remember their name? It's
somebody
[00:12:43] Michael Zarick: I'm in Louisville.
Oh, okay, cool. Yeah. I I don't know if you would
know them.
[00:12:46] Elysia Lucinda: Yeah, it's kind of a tight knit group of people that do that, especially in my neighborhood. Oh really? Yeah.
Irvington is like all the witch witches, everything. The Wu
[00:12:53] Michael Zarick: capital of the world. Yes,
[00:12:54] Elysia Lucinda: it fucking is. It's
Halloween town. USAI
[00:12:56] Michael Zarick: need to come
over.
[00:12:57] Elysia Lucinda: Yeah. Halloween festivals on the
25th, so if you wanna see a slap
that's the time to go. Oh, go. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:13:04] Michael Zarick: what, uh,
does it mean to you to have Proof: A Midwest Lit Fest mm-hmm. Here as like a a presence
in Indianapolis, in Indiana. Uh, and like, what
does it mean as a writer,
as a bookseller, as a, as a person,
[00:13:18] Elysia Lucinda: um, I say this a lot, um, writing as a art form doesn't get a lot of funding in our city in particular. And I'm sure that's the case in other cities. Um. But it's one of those things that takes
a long time to do. So, you know, when you're, when you're looking for grant funding and you're an arts council,
you want a really cool flashy one off event, or an artist
that has a lot, a visual artist, musician, like someone who can turn something around pretty quickly. Um, and writing doesn't tend
to do that, you know, like if poetry may be, you know, but, um, having a lit fest that fully encompasses what writing actually is. Um, to get some representation on that is really, really, really important. Yeah. Um, I, I
mean, I just want for writers you know? That's good.
Let's go.hy, that's like, every time I come to this and someone asks me like, why, why Proof? Or, you know, what do you love about
Proof I'm like. Give money to writers. That's all I want. I want fiction writers and nonfiction writers and people
doing weird writing shit to get money
in this city, you know?
Uh,
as opposed to the, you know, what, what tends to get funded. And I'm not saying that shit isn't amazing. It's amazing.
We have a robust art scene here. Um, but, you know, save a little for some of us who can't show you our work right away, you know?
[00:14:34] Michael Zarick: Definitely.
[00:14:34] Elysia Lucinda: Mm-hmm.
[00:14:34] Michael Zarick: Uh, so what makes Irvington
Vinyl in book.
Uh, unique. Like, what are you
selling? What are you, what's, what's the, oh, we're
[00:14:40] Elysia Lucinda: actually the only used bookstore in the 4 65 loop.
[00:14:45] Michael Zarick: Wait for real?
[00:14:46] Elysia Lucinda: Uh huh Huh. Um, Dream Palace recently closed, unfortunately, and they were the only other one.
Um, some of the stores have a very small selection of used books. I, I believe Whispering Shelf has some free books and a small
selection of used material.
Um, but we are exclusively used. I like to call us Indianapolis' Premier Analog store because we have vinyl, we have
cassettes, we have DVDs, we have books, we have
CDs, we have, um, a ton of local art. And then I have an entire
room of VHS
tapes. I have about 2000 VHS tapes in the store.
[00:15:21] Michael Zarick: Um, 2000.
[00:15:22] Elysia Lucinda: Yeah. It's awesome.
Mm-hmm.
[00:15:24] Michael Zarick: I really need to come over. Yeah.
[00:15:26] Elysia Lucinda: Come hang out anytime.
[00:15:28] Michael Zarick: What do you, are you reading anything right now?
[00:15:29] Elysia Lucinda: Uh, well it's okay
[00:15:31] Michael Zarick: if you're not.
[00:15:31] Elysia Lucinda: Well, I am. I just don't remember
what it is. I read a lot of of books once often. You, you do too much. Yeah.
[00:15:38] Michael Zarick: It all escapes your brain. My brains.
[00:15:39] Elysia Lucinda: Oh, actually I have a copy of what I'm reading right now. Don't read it. It's trash. Um, don't read
[00:15:45] Michael Zarick: it.
[00:15:45] Elysia Lucinda: No, it's really, I love, um, I love like going through like reading a smut, like vintage smut. Um, it's all bad though cause it's all men writing shit about women's bodies, but. I find it really fun. Um, there's a, so I'm
reading this, um, by Mason Hoffenberg Sex in America
[00:16:02] Michael Zarick: After the same event?
[00:16:04] Elysia Lucinda: No, this is Candy. Candy. It's a movie also. Um, yeah. Terry Southern Mason Hoffenberg.
[00:16:10] Michael Zarick: There's a, there's like a subreddit. It's called like Men writing Women. Oh,
[00:16:14] Elysia Lucinda: yeah.
That
[00:16:14] Michael Zarick: just has the most heinous, like it's terrible.
[00:16:17] Elysia Lucinda: Yeah.
[00:16:18] Michael Zarick: Uh, we always make a joke. It's like, boobies, boobing,
[00:16:22] Elysia Lucinda: This, this is like that, you know?
But it's also like. Uh, I just, um, I just finished a book called a Miriam at 30. Um, and it was the, kind of the same thing, but like, it's really fascinating the way men try to write women's interiority while also sexualizing them. Um, and that book was way better than this one. This one is just trash. Yeah.
Like, it's just fun trash. Yeah. Um, but that book was really interesting because. The author tried to do justice, but just didn't have the emotional tools to do justice, you know? Um, it's
[00:16:58] Michael Zarick: hard for men to have the emotional tools. No.
[00:17:00] Elysia Lucinda: Period.
[00:17:02] Michael Zarick: Uh, well thank you so much for talking to me. Yeah. Uh, who Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you too. Yeah, I'm sure. We'll, we'll come across each other's paths. Yeah. Again, uh, who should I go talk to?
[00:17:11] Elysia Lucinda: Oh, Ujaama right here. Next to Ujaama to me.
Yeah. Yeah, they're really nice.
[00:17:15] Michael Zarick: I've been looking to talk to them. Yeah. For a long time.
[00:17:16] Elysia Lucinda: They're super nice. Thank you so much. Yeah.
[00:17:18] Michael Zarick: Uh, hello. I'm here with Dr. Adam Henze Hello of Indy Type Shop Fame. Yeah. Also a Third Space Indy guest in the past. Go listen to that episode Dr. Hensey, we are here at Proof Midwest Lit Fest. Yes. Uh, can you tell me a little bit about what it means to you to have this space?
To have this event on this weekend, this
beautiful weekend?
[00:17:40] Adam Henze: Well, I mean, giving some background, uh, knowing about how the event came
to be. Uh, Chantel and Mitchell Douglas were like, we don't have a literary festival in Indianapolis. And there also is this kind of, uh, rich culture of Black literary history here in
Indianapolis that we often don't celebrate in our schools and in our institutions.
So it's not necessarily a Black lit fest, but it feels like
it, right? it feels like we are celebrating, um, some of the most important authors in Indianapolis. Uh, some of the most important authors that are in the conversation that have connections to Indianapolis. Uh, so I love participating in a place remembering RCA Dome Indianapolis, where we felt like we didn't have our own things.
It's cool to have our own things.
[00:18:34] Michael Zarick: Absolutely.
[00:18:35] Adam Henze: Yeah.
[00:18:36] Michael Zarick: Uh, I'm
gonna dig on
you a little bit. Sure. Not really. I like it. Uh, I'm prepared. Do you feel like all great artists need to lose an ear? Ooh,
[00:18:46] Adam Henze: uh. Yeah. Or mean, you know, maybe some
kind of sacrifice or something like that. Sacrifice, you know, to take your, uh, funny question a little too seriously.
Like. I think we often don't know about disability and authorship, you know, so, um, thanks for, uh, thanks for, um, sharing with everybody that, um, no, I think that's interesting. I have to
go hat every once in a while. Do you actually, but, uh, not anymore.
I thought it's come back. It's come back. Yeah. So I'm gonna have a hearing test in a couple of months in January.
We'll see how I do, but. Um, I've been like skirting in the deaf, commu deaf community. Yeah. Maybe I'm skirting out of there. I don't,
it's And it's
a weird feeling,
[00:19:22] Michael Zarick: actually. I'm glad you brought that up 'cause I didn't think about it that way, but I, I am glad you did. Are there any deaf authors that you know of that
are excellent?
[00:19:30] Adam Henze: Oh, that's a really great question. , Uh, I believe that Bernie Wrightson was partially deaf and, really kind of concealed it. we don't have any of his books today, but, um, he was an awesome, horror illustrator. Uh, and then we sell his, uh, Swan song book Frankenstein Alive in the bookstore. I mean, I'm trying to think.
Yeah, it's a good question. I need to, I
need to get into some more deaf authors.
[00:19:55] Michael Zarick: Yeah. I wonder.
[00:19:56] Adam Henze: Yeah. that's
[00:19:57] Michael Zarick: an interesting it would be interesting to hear their perspective on the world or the way they write. Absolutely.
Anything
else you wanna talk about?
[00:20:03] Adam Henze: I don't think so. I'm just super excited.
Um, I'm excited to see you here. I think this is a, a, a cool room of friends that I, you know, have been spending the last 20 years with and then know new friends that I've only known in the last couple of months, and it's exciting.
[00:20:17] Michael Zarick: Indiana Humanities asked me to come they were like, Hey, have you heard of so and so?
And I was like, yeah. And they're like, oh, have you heard of so and so? They're like, oh, they're on the podcast. And they're like, oh, have you heard
this person? I was like, yeah, we met last week. And I was like, it's funny how, how, you people, you you people, uh, Adam Henze, uh, Bill Brooks, uh, Ruba Marshood, all these people I've met with Yeah.
And recorded with are doing such incredible things in their own right and very different things, but still within the realm of reading, writing, and literacy.
[00:20:48] Adam Henze: Yeah, I can't remember if we talked about this on the podcast, but I just got to go to Milwaukee last week. Oh, yeah. And I feel there was some like similarities between Milwaukee and Indianapolis. You know, Beyonce is gonna skip us over, you know,
Taylor Swift came here, but like for the most part, you know, the, the, the,
the big names might go to Chicago or, or might skip us over, but literary stuff convention stuff
like. We are, um, really finding, um, a home for fan culture, for collectors, for thrift, for readers, and I think that's super special.
Yeah. And I think that we have something here in Indianapolis that they don't have in Chicago, they don't have in LA and, and that kind of stuff. And, um, you're seeing it in this room. Amazing.
[00:21:29] Michael Zarick: Well, thank you for dressing up for me. Of course. yeah. yeah. Uh, put the jacket
[00:21:32] Adam Henze: on, you know.
[00:21:33] Michael Zarick: Uh, who should I go talk to next?
[00:21:35] Adam Henze: I would go talk to Each Other's Books if you do not talk to them. Um, they're a New bookstore down there.
[00:21:39] Michael Zarick: Hey, uh, I'm here with Keaun Michael Brown of Ujaama Books. That's me. That is you. That's me. Can you tell me a little bit about Ujaama and maybe a little bit about Flanner House as well?
[00:21:50] Keaun Michael Brown: Yeah, the bigger, of course. I got you. Yes, please. So Flanner House is like the biggest oldest. It's one of the oldest nonprofits in the state.
It's one of the oldest Black nonprofits in the state too. We just celebrated our 127th anniversary a couple days ago, which was super dope. Uh, they're all about like. The things that are happening, the inequities in our communities that are occurring are by design, and it's unfortunate. It's a direct response of systemic racism and oppression.
We all know this, and also. Waiting around for the city or for the politicians, or for the state or the federal government to solve the problems that are actually going on. People die in the interim waiting period. You feel me? If we wait, we're waiting forever for Black folks to take care of Black folks.
So Flanner House is all about how do we address the immediate needs of our community right now, because people die if we don't. You feel me? So we made a bookstore. Uh, we sell all types. See this? All types. Look at this. Yeah. All this black literature, uh, all types of really dope. Black and Afro-Latino and other minority authors literature in the bookstore.
All about giving, you know, more power to people who like empowering people by showing them the power they have within themselves. A really dope way, and that's us. And, and we do it through books and event planning.
[00:23:01] Michael Zarick: Let's
[00:23:01] Keaun Michael Brown: go.
[00:23:01] Michael Zarick: And you also do a ton of, well you've mentioned events just now. Can you tell me a couple of events you've had recently where you're carrying out that action?
[00:23:08] Keaun Michael Brown: For sure, for sure. Well, with Ujaama I
[00:23:11] Michael Zarick: don't care. Whatever.
[00:23:11] Keaun Michael Brown: Okay. Hell yeah. Yeah. So I both too. I both do events for Ujaama. I also plan a lot of events myself. I do a lot of community shit in the city. I had a big cross-cultural banquet back in April that was super dope. Uh, that was hundreds of people.
All these different cultural food, all these different types of dances and all that. That was super dope. Uh, we just did a Hispanic Heritage month at Ujaama last because I'm half Dominican, so we got to do all that. And I got to, I, I thought people had to dance bachata, which is super cool. Uh, just a lot of dope events where I get to meet people where they're at and showcase.
I think it's super dope. I think Indy is the second most diverse city I've lived in my entire life. Second only to New York City. Swear to God. Okay. Okay. So dope. I was the first. It's so dope because. Niggas don't really notice how much stuff is in this city. We have mad Burmese people on the south side, crazy amount of Haitians out far east.
We got like Black people everywhere. Tons of Mexicans over West Washington street, tons of Arabs up. There's so much in this city and if you don't go outside and talk to niggas you like, you never find it. And I love this city so much. I love so many people. All the dope culture we have. 'cause people think the city is bland and boring and it's nothing.
It's not. There's so much here. And you just gotta talk to people and realize, oh, there's so much here. There's massive amounts of Afghanis, um, of Nigerians, of Ghanaians, of Gide. There's so much. If you just talk to people out in the city, and I like to put events together, even though I'm broke as hell, I do it in my own pocket.
I like to put events together to showcase people that like, oh, this is real. And the best part about this city to me is it's a place of average ass people all trying to make a living. And that means everyone is on the same playing field. That means everyone got a dope story that needs to be told. So that's what I try to do with my event plan.
I think it's sick as hell.
[00:24:53] Michael Zarick: Preach. I, I don't know what else to say. I, uh, you know what I wanna say is Lala is like, this man's got a lot to say. I do
[00:24:59] Keaun Michael Brown: got
[00:25:00] Michael Zarick: a lot of shit because I'm
[00:25:00] Keaun Michael Brown: always pissed off. So I always got
[00:25:01] Michael Zarick: a lot of shit to say. Um, let's talk about Proof. Yeah. That's where we are.
[00:25:06] Keaun Michael Brown: That's what we are, that's what we, what does it mean
[00:25:07] Michael Zarick: to you to have this event to be able to come out into public, talk about Ujaama, have this come together moment of varying, varying writers, uh, poets.
Readers, I don't know, because there's like,
[00:25:22] Keaun Michael Brown: there's books. There's books everywhere. That's dope as hell to me, and I feel like there's a scarcity mindset, especially independent bookstores, right. Of. Everyone's selling books, so there's no point of having 12 different independent bookstores. And this is like, no, actually, fuck that.
There is room. We're here. Tomorrow's here. Kurt Vonnegut's here. All these people are here and we're all selling books because like the scarcity mindset is a myth. It's made up. It's a Fugazi fake blah, it doesn't exist. And to have people all here talking about books, showcasing their words, talking about literacy, I think is so cool.
I grew up in the hood, not a pot to pissing. My family was super poor. And even when we're homeless at times, what always had was a library. Anywhere I've ever lived in America, we have a big privilege in this country that we have a massive library system. Um, and I grew up in the library system. It pretty much raised me and I grew up around words and they raised me.
And it was so beautiful to be able to endorse myself in words my entire life. And I feel like in a world where we think that, people tell me all the time, they don't like reading truly 'cause they've been force fed books that weren't made for them, that weren't, that weren't fought for them, that weren't, weren't made to teach them.
So the fact that I get to be surrounded by other writers and I get to showcase this wide selection of Black, Native American, Latino literature right here, that means that people can come here when they've never felt, even the ones who, even the ones who already read. And they never seen themselves before in literature.
Get to come here, see us, and be inspired to write again. And that to me is the whole cycle that I love so much, man. Like I love to write. I'm a writer myself. I'm a poet, I'm a writer, I'm a author. But the words don't matter. It's the stories that I need to be told that matter to me. The fact that we get to go here and inspire people to tell more stories, that's dope as hell.
Like, I'm excited. We have Proof. Shout out Double P Dog.
[00:27:07] Michael Zarick: Uh, that's Keaun Michael Brown. That's me. That's your Ujaama bookstore. That's Ujaama book. Check out Flanner House.
[00:27:11] Keaun Michael Brown: Check out Flanner House. Amazing. Check out Indiana Humanities.
[00:27:14] Michael Zarick: Indiana. Yeah, I can't even say it. Indiana Humanities. Proof of Midwest Life Fest.
Uh, Keaun Michael Brown. We connecting later.
[00:27:21] Keaun Michael Brown: We will be connecting later, guaranteed. For sure. Uh oh. Yeah. Uh,
[00:27:24] Michael Zarick: where should I go next?
[00:27:26] Keaun Michael Brown: In the city or here? Right around here. Okay. Right around here. Uh, have you hit up tomorrow? Bookstore. I've hit up like basically this whole quadrant. Okay. Bet then hit up. I would say.
Each other's books from my friend Amethyst runs it. My Auntie Amethyst runs it. Got it. That's good. People, good family. Amazing. Good. Good talks. Good books. Good Everything. Let's
[00:27:42] Michael Zarick: do it.
[00:27:42] Keaun Michael Brown: Hell yeah. Peace. See you.
[00:27:44] Michael Zarick: Hey, I'm here with Marisol and Jen who both work for Indiana Humanities.
[00:27:48] Marisol Gouveia: I work for you work for any humanities and sometimes she does too. Sometimes I'm volunteer today. Okay. Well, we'll take
[00:27:53] Michael Zarick: volunteers too. We are here at Proof Midwest Lit Fest or a Midwest Lit.
Um, can you guys tell me a little bit about yourselves and a little bit about why Proof is so important to you?
[00:28:05] Jen Thomas: I'll start. Yeah. Um, well I love all the programming that Indiana Humanities does, so I go to as many things as they put on as possible. But I also love reading and love celebrating work by Indiana Creatives, whether they're writers or visual artists or performers.
So I just love the arts and love, uh, that this is a new event that the public can get to know more about Indiana authors and Indiana books.
[00:28:32] Michael Zarick: Amazing. Thank you for sharing Marisol.
[00:28:34] Marisol Gouveia: Um, I work in the United Humanities. I'm a humanities geek at heart. You know that, that's my background. Uhhuh, that's what I love to do.
I read a lot of books in my spare time and, um, this is just my community and I love to see people that I know, people that I love sort of have their cup filled by this event. Mm-hmm. And they're coming out and they love to listen. They love to think, read and talk about. The world around them, and this is just the event to do it at.
Definitely. So I'm just happy to see all the people I love come together in a affirming and loving space.
[00:29:09] Michael Zarick: Oh, thank you for sharing. Uh, we're gonna retread some old ground here When we first met. There was some internal confusion with me about the difference between the arts and humanities. Mm-hmm. Can you share again with me so I can recall, but also for the people?
[00:29:24] Marisol Gouveia: I think the, the easiest way to think about it is that the humanities help us explore the things that make us human. So the, the way that we live, the things that we create, the things that we write. Our history, our future. And so that's where the humanities really bring to our lives and help us enrich our lives with
[00:29:44] Michael Zarick: Definitely.
Yeah. Uh, thank you for sharing. Thank you. And that's what we're doing here at Proof. Uh, can you tell me a little bit about what's going on with Indiana Humanities?
[00:29:54] Marisol Gouveia: Sure. Yeah. So Indiana Humanities is a statewide nonprofit. We, uh, exist to serve all nine two counties of Indiana. Um, we try to support. Anyone who wants to, um, participate in the humanities grant, access to communities, to individuals who want to talk, have conversations about the places they live, the people they live next to, uh, what happened in the past and how they might together as a community face, what's, um, you know, what's coming, what.
The future might hold. So, um, that's what we do and we do that in various ways. We, uh, encourage, you know, like writers, we encourage historians, we encourage just regular community members who want to do something for the neighborhood, for the neighbors, for the people next to them. So definitely. Yeah.
[00:30:43] Michael Zarick: And Jen, what about the Indiana Humanities drew you into.
Regularly volunteer to the point where you're here buddy, buddy with Marisol.
[00:30:51] Jen Thomas: Yes, I'm buddy buddy. She is my friend. But I think Marisol made a good point about bringing together people I love and people I, uh, respect and I love that we can, um, explore ideas together. And I know I said it's, it's an arts event, but it's.
It's it, not to confuse you, it's a it's a cultural event. Don't confuse me, but, but in, there are a lot of similarities, but I think, I love meeting people who I don't know, who I learned from and some of the other events I've gone to with Indiana Humanities, I've come home and thought, oh, I, that's a new way to think of this.
In fact, in one case I went and dug out something, a fa, a piece of family. A history, I guess you could say. Yeah. As a result of an event, um, that I, I just hadn't, hadn't wouldn't have come to that before. So they really produced great events and programs that get people thinking and talking to each other.
So it's a way to engage with people that maybe you wouldn't have before.
[00:31:50] Michael Zarick: Yeah.
[00:31:51] Jen Thomas: And learn from each other.
[00:31:52] Michael Zarick: Banger. Uh, one last question. Assuming and it will Proof, makes it to 10 years, what's your, what's your dream?
[00:32:01] Marisol Gouveia: Oh. Like crowds and like, we have to like really, really consider where people gonna park. And you know, I just, I think 10 years in, I want people to fill every need, fill every want to have everyone satisfied to.
Have all the crowds to have Indiana people from around the Midwest because we talk about it being a Midwest Lit Fest. So I want this to be a draw. People from Minnesota, coming people from Illinois, Ohio, just everyone around us coming to Indiana because, no, that's okay. That's, I was gonna say, we're gonna have hotel rooms full.
Yes. Visit Indy is gonna be like really concerned about when Proof is, because we're gonna fill hotels. That's the 10 year dream. Yeah, that's the 10 year dream Visit Indy's concerned about hotel bookings.
[00:32:58] Michael Zarick: Amazing. Yeah. Uh, we heard this statement yesterday that Indianapolis. Is the crossroads of America over and over again historically, maybe it'll be the crossroads of United States Humanities.
There you go. There you go. Yeah.
[00:33:12] Marisol Gouveia: Thank
[00:33:12] Michael Zarick: you. Right on. All right. Thank you guys for joining me.
Hey, uh, I'm here with Bethany and Sasha, our favorite little friend here who has the most beautiful snoot of all time. Um,
so Bethany and Sasha are part of an organization called Paws & Think and they are here. Mm-hmm.
At Proof a Midwest Lit Fest.
Uh,
doing a thing where people come and read to the dog.
Yeah. Yeah. Can you
tell me a little bit about that?
[00:33:40] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: Yeah. So, um, Paws & Think has
a number of dogs that go out to local libraries, um, and different schools in the area. Um, and
kids can read to
the dogs. Um, some hesitant readers are a little nervous to read in front of people. Um, they're worried that they're gonna laugh at them, make fun of them.
Um, dogs are nonjudgmental. Um, so they've done a lot of
studies that
show that. Um,
kids who practice reading
the dogs, um, grow a lot in their reading skills. Um, the dog
just kind of sits there. Um. Some of our dogs, uh, will actually like, look at the books
as the kids are reading. Sasha doesn't because she's a princess.
[00:34:17] Michael Zarick: Sasha is a, a diva, as you said. Yes,
[00:34:19] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: she is. Um, she
does her own thing. She's, she's perfect. Um, but the kids read to the dogs, get some practice reading skills, um, and, uh, improve their reading.
[00:34:30] Michael Zarick: How did you get involved with, Paws & Think
[00:34:33] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: there's a couple different programs in Paws & Think. Okay. So one of the programs is Paws & Read I'm obsessed with my dog. Um, she enjoys people admiring her. And petting
her and she has just like a super great
personality. Mm-hmm.
I volunteer, um, in other animal assistant activities and I kind of figured if I have a dog with a great personality, um, I'd love to get her out, um, helping people. Um, and she loves it. she loves people coming up and petting her, admiring her. She likes her job. Um, and most of the time she is just my pet dog. Um, and we get to go do some cool stuff, meet some cool people. and it's been super great.
[00:35:12] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Are you, do you
consider yourself a reader yourself?
[00:35:14] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: Um, sometimes.
Sometimes. Sometimes. Yeah. I'm mostly nonfiction.
[00:35:17] Michael Zarick: Okay.
[00:35:18] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: Um, but, um, I go through spits and spurts where I'll read like 200 books in a year, and then the next year I'll be like two books in a year.
[00:35:26] Michael Zarick: I feel like I a very, there's no shame in that.
[00:35:29] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know? Yeah.
[00:35:31] Michael Zarick: Uh.
The woman behind the camera is a, a prolific
reader in my Oh, she's
shaking her head.
Yeah. .
[00:35:37] Bethany Oestrich and Sasha: How can people learn about your organization? Oh, we
have a website. Um. And honestly I think it
might just be like, Paws & Think. Um, if you do a Google search, you should be able to find it. We have social media. Um, I know that we have Instagrams. I feel like Sasha's probably gonna be on it 'cause I saw
the folks that do social media taking pictures of her earlier. Um, and um, we have info on there like if you wanna volunteer with your dog. If you wanna volunteer without a dog, if you're a person who loves dogs, we always need people without dogs to help train the dogs.
and just be like a person to get the dog used to going out in kind of weird, unusual situations. Um, and then like if you're with an organization who thinks that like they would wanna team to come out, the information on how to do, that's there.
[00:36:21] Michael Zarick: Well thank you for sharing.
Yeah. Uh, and that'll be in the show notes of.
Of course. Uh, thank you Bethany. Yeah. And
thank you Sasha for being such
a good dog. Yes,
she's perfect. Uh,
[00:36:30] Michael Zarick: It's okay. I'll cut out all the bs. Uh, it's the best part. Hello? I can't, I can't handle myself. Uh, hi. I'm here with Carrie from the Ray Bradbury Center. Yes. Uh, and the reason I walked up actually, is because I run a podcast called Third Space Indy The man who originally coined the term third place.
Wrote a book called The Great Good Place and his name is Ray Oldenberg. And I get Ray Oldenberg and Ray Bradbury mixed up constantly.
[00:36:59] Carrie Cooper: Amazing.
[00:37:00] Michael Zarick: This is the only reason I walked over. I like this. Yeah. Uh, so can you tell me a little bit about the Ray Bradbury Center? Ray Bradbury maybe. 'cause I don't even know if I know.
Sure. Uh, and then just about yourself. Maybe?
[00:37:14] Carrie Cooper: Yeah. Okay. Well. Ray Bradbury is probably best known for dystopian fiction novel Fahrenheit 451,
[00:37:24] Michael Zarick: which I have read. Um, I don't know why I'm pretending like I haven't. Yeah.
[00:37:27] Carrie Cooper: Uh, that's probably what he is most known for. Most US kids anyway. Had to read it in probably high school.
[00:37:34] Michael Zarick: Yeah.
[00:37:35] Carrie Cooper: Um, in some places it's still part of the curriculum. It was censored at one point,
[00:37:40] Michael Zarick: it's a little, it's funny to have a book about banning books. Banned. Yes. It's a little topical. It's, it's it a little,
[00:37:46] Carrie Cooper: yeah.
Kind of, kind of meta. anyway, so the Ray Bradbury Center is on the campus of IU Indianapolis. Um, it was founded by two scholars who, uh, were good, good friends of Ray Bradbury. And, uh, Dr. Jonathan Eller has written, um, the definitive biographies of Ray Bradbury's life. Um, the Center, uh, originally existed to do like scholarship, um, specifically on the works of Ray Bradbury.
Um, about five years ago. Yeah, roughly five years ago now. Um, we started, uh, doing a lot more outreach into the community. and so I mean, speaking of third spaces, like our, our space on IUI's campus. Um, being on campus and all that is a little bit tricky. Yeah. Um, but we're also interested in engaging the community in literacy building activities.
And so we do that by going out of the community. Yeah. Um, and, and bringing, you know, topics
[00:38:48] Michael Zarick: is, is, uh, Ray Bradbury a, an Indiana man,
[00:38:52] Carrie Cooper: Ray Bradbury actually grew up in Waukegan, Illinois.
[00:38:54] Michael Zarick: Okay.
[00:38:55] Carrie Cooper: Spent the first 11, I think, years of his life in Waukegan.
[00:38:59] Michael Zarick: So we've him away.
[00:39:01] Carrie Cooper: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Then he, then he moved to, to la so Oh yeah.
And he was a Hollywood man for pretty much the rest of his life. Um, but he loved the Midwest. And a lot of his, um, a lot of his work has this kind of Midwest, kind of feel to it. Yeah. Talks a lot about the Midwest. Makes sense. Um, he is, it said that he created the Midwest Gothic, as a, as kind of as a genre.
So, um, the one that always springs to mind for me in the Midwest gothic genre would be like, Something Wicked This Way Comes. Which was a Ray Bradbury, uh, novel and also a movie, um, which we screened at CanCan speaking again, of like taking it out into the community.
[00:39:43] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Um,
[00:39:44] Carrie Cooper: and then had a discussion after we do a festival in September.
It's called Festival
[00:39:50] Michael Zarick: I think I, I have heard. Yeah.
[00:39:51] Carrie Cooper: Yeah. And so it's all like basically encouraging primarily adults. We love children, but lots of people do children stuff, Uhhuh. Um, but encouraging adults to spend more time in literacy building activities. Yeah. Um, you know, and just. Like using, you know, technologies and different styles of media to um, create space for that kind of dialogue
[00:40:17] Michael Zarick: That makes sense
[00:40:18] Carrie Cooper: in, in a fun way.
[00:40:18] Michael Zarick: Can you tell me a little bit about what it means? Uh, 'cause we're at Proof. Yeah. Can you tell me a little bit about what Proof means to you, uh, personally, like what it means to come together as writers, as readers, as people who appreciate the humanities.
[00:40:31] Carrie Cooper: Yeah. I, you know, I think for me one of the most amazing things about it is that we can, we can begin to feel so isolated.
You know, writing is kind of sol a solitary activity. At least it can be unless you're in writing groups. But even then you're not writing together all the time. Right? Yeah. Reading can be a very solitary activity. Um, and then when we do things like this as a community and we come out and we get to see each other, we get to, to meet people that we hadn't.
You know, maybe didn't even know existed. Um, uh, when Tomorrow Books started to put on the, the book fest in the spring, um, for the book crawl. Mm-hmm. The book crawl. Yeah. Uh, it was just astonishing. So we participated in that too. We did a popup, um, at, uh, Dear Mom Indy Uhhuh on 10th Street. Um, and it was just astonishing how many people came out.
Phenomen. Um, I do a program at Indy Reads, it's called the multilingual read aloud. We do it once a year for the, um, Festival 451 one of the things that we talk about in that situation as well is just like we've got, like in Indiana, gets a reputation or has a reputation as being this like, you know, highly conservative, backward, red state.
We are so much more complex than that. Like in the people who, uh, live in the city of Indianapolis They read, they write, they engage. And I think something like Proof like gives us an opportunity to really see that, um, like, you know, kind of manifest and gives us a chance to, um, connect with folks that we wouldn't necessarily get to connect with otherwise.
Uh, it's just, it's this beautiful thing. I, I was standing over. Perusing books at at is actually at Tomorrow. Yeah. And Bernard Shaw walked up to me and said, you want to buy this one? And I was like, as a matter of fact, I do. And how amazing that I actually gotta, you're
[00:42:29] Michael Zarick: being told, stand
[00:42:30] Carrie Cooper: next to him and talk to him about the book and peruse the book and, and just be excited for him and with him ab about.
Like this endeavor. Yeah. It's, it's really cool.
[00:42:42] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Amazing answer.
[00:42:43] Carrie Cooper: I'm also an optimist by nature,
[00:42:45] Michael Zarick: but Absolutely. I think we should be, I think more people should be optimists. Sometimes I catch myself being a deep cynic, but yes, I try to push that away. Uh, Carrie. Yes. Right. Yes. Well, thank you for sharing all of that stuff with me.
Yeah. Anything else you wanna drop before you in
[00:42:58] Carrie Cooper: Ah, come see us at Ray Bradbury Center. Why not? Let's
[00:43:00] Michael Zarick: do it. Right on. Yeah. Cool. Cool.
[00:43:02] Carrie Cooper: Thank you.
[00:43:02] Michael Zarick: So I'm here with Wendy who runs Kid's Ink Books. And from what I know, you just, I don't know how capital of a J that just is, but you just purchased February?
February,
[00:43:14] Wendy Fitzgerald: no, June is when we purchased the store.
[00:43:16] Michael Zarick: Oh, that's crazy. Yes. And you moved here in February? Yes. So Anna and I moved to Indianapolis at the end of last October. Okay. So we're also very new.
[00:43:23] Wendy Fitzgerald: Yeah.
[00:43:23] Michael Zarick: Uh, tell me a little bit about your experience to moving to Indianapolis.
[00:43:28] Wendy Fitzgerald: So, um, I was not, not particularly pleased about moving to Indianapolis to begin with.
[00:43:34] Michael Zarick: Yeah.
[00:43:35] Wendy Fitzgerald: Truthfully.
[00:43:36] Michael Zarick: Yeah.
[00:43:36] Wendy Fitzgerald: Um, but I fell in love with it. Uh, during the spring, uh, the neighborhood that I chose to live in was full of gardens and, and mature trees, and the community has. Welcomed me as a person into the neighborhood and now as a business into the community, and it's been so great.
[00:43:54] Michael Zarick: Yeah. What's your neighborhood?
[00:43:55] Wendy Fitzgerald: Uh, I live in Butler-Talkington. Oh,
[00:43:57] Michael Zarick: you live right next to where you work? I
[00:43:58] Wendy Fitzgerald: can see the store from my front door. Let's,
[00:44:00] Michael Zarick: let's go. So what, uh, so you were captured so heavily in the spring that you were compelled to purchase a bookstore.
[00:44:08] Wendy Fitzgerald: Well, there's, it's a little bit
[00:44:10] Michael Zarick: deeper than that.
Yeah. Tell me, tell me.
[00:44:12] Wendy Fitzgerald: So my daughter mm-hmm. Uh, Caitlyn, who also owns the store with me. Okay. Um, she moved down in December from Chicago. Okay. I came down from Wisconsin. Um, we both bought houses and settled in, and then we both lost our corporate jobs.
[00:44:27] Michael Zarick: Okay. I'm so sorry, but That's okay. We moved on. No, I lost my job too.
[00:44:30] Wendy Fitzgerald: It turned out really well. So we were both looking for something bookstore was for sale.
[00:44:41] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.
[00:44:41] Wendy Fitzgerald: And, uh, decided to pursue it. Yeah. And so it all went down from there.
[00:44:47] Michael Zarick: Let's go.
[00:44:48] Wendy Fitzgerald: Yeah. We're so excited to be here.
[00:44:49] Michael Zarick: I love that.
Yeah. Uh, you and I have very weirdly similar stories. Yeah. Uh, so can you tell me a little bit about Kid's Ink
Uh, well, Kid's Ink Is
[00:44:58] Wendy Fitzgerald: in Butler Talkington. Yes, it is. Right on
[00:45:01] Michael Zarick: Illinois.
[00:45:01] Wendy Fitzgerald: Been there for, uh, 39 years this year. Um, and it's, uh, all kids books and toys and we try to give kids things to do that don't include a screen and, uh, make sure that kids see themselves in books.
[00:45:17] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Has the reception been pretty good to you? You kind of rebranded the bookstore, right?
[00:45:21] Wendy Fitzgerald: Yeah, so I was a little worried about rebranding it because it's been here for 40 years and. Beloved in the neighborhood, right? Yeah. Um, but we kept some of the elements of the original, uh, logo and just added, um, Paige, who was our squid, uh, her name is Paige Turner.
Um, just to have something for the kids to connect to.
[00:45:42] Michael Zarick: That's pretty funny. Um, so we are here at Proof. We are. Can you tell me a little bit about what it means to you as a bookstore owner to have an event like this, uh, that brings people together? And especially as a kids bookstore owner, 'cause you have a little bit of a different perspective than maybe some of the other people here.
Um,
[00:46:00] Wendy Fitzgerald: so maybe, I think being new to the area too, I'm just thrilled about Yeah. Proof. Uh, I've been really impressed with the organization, how things have been well labeled. I think the sessions have been really great. Um. And then as a supporting bookstore, it's been really kind of cool hanging out with the other bookstore owners, which we don't get to do a lot.
[00:46:23] Michael Zarick: definitely.
[00:46:24] Wendy Fitzgerald: And, um, and just being here to support our authors. So as a kids' bookstore, we're supporting the children's authors that are here today. Yeah. Um, and Jana is a really good example. She actually lives in our neighborhood.
[00:46:36] Michael Zarick: What's this
[00:46:36] Wendy Fitzgerald: one? So these are her books,
[00:46:38] Michael Zarick: baby. Let's go.
[00:46:39] Wendy Fitzgerald: That's her new book, baby.
[00:46:41] Michael Zarick: Let's go to the orchestra. That's what it says. Yes. I can read. Yeah.
[00:46:44] Wendy Fitzgerald: So, uh, and Annie, uh, Sullivan is a friend of ours too, and, uh, she's got Ghouldilocks there and so it's really cool. They're our friends Yeah. To support them and, you know, be here to network with everybody.
[00:46:57] Michael Zarick: Amazing. Well, thank you so much for sharing, Wendy.
[00:46:59] Wendy Fitzgerald: Yeah. Uh,
[00:47:00] Michael Zarick: we can find you on Illinois Street. You, what's the address?
[00:47:04] Wendy Fitzgerald: Uh, 5619 North Illinois Street. There we
[00:47:06] Michael Zarick: go. Perfect. Go get some ice cream and follow us on Instagram. Yeah. Get some ice cream Graeter's, get some coffee at Tinker Street and then walk over. Read a book.
[00:47:12] Wendy Fitzgerald: That's right. We got with your kids.
Lots of story times and all kinds of stuff.
[00:47:16] Michael Zarick: I'm here with Kory uh, Each Other's Books. Yeah, we just met, uh, all I know is that I've seen a couple of your posts on Instagram, but can you tell me a little bit about each other's?
So I can ask a better question.
[00:47:28] Korie Griggs: Yeah. So each other's books, we curate all of our books on Joy care and what we wanna see more of in the world. And Amethyst and I's Friendship started when we just started sharing books back and forth. And I would like annotate. She would annotate, we'd talk about it and be like, okay, well how can we world build in this way?
And then we started dreaming together and created a bookstore.
[00:47:49] Michael Zarick: That's amazing.
[00:47:50] Korie Griggs: Yeah.
[00:47:50] Michael Zarick: Um, where are you guys located?
[00:47:51] Korie Griggs: We are inside of Mochi Joy and Fishers off of 96th Street. And unfortunately I was
[00:47:56] Michael Zarick: gonna ask, there you go.
[00:47:57] Korie Griggs: Unfortunately, uh, Mochi Joy will be closing permanently on November 2nd, so we are uncertain what's next for us in terms of a physical space, but we're gonna take time just to calibrate rest and figure out what's next.
[00:48:11] Michael Zarick: Okay. Well thank you for sharing.
[00:48:13] Korie Griggs: Yeah. Uh,
[00:48:14] Michael Zarick: so I love what you said about. Wanting, basically forming your bookstore around your entire friendship. Something I found as someone who is continually a newly burgeoning reader, it happens yearly. Yeah. Uh, is that when I find a book that I think someone else will love, and I say, Hey, you should read this.
And then they go do it. And they go back to me and they go, oh my God, that book is amazing. Yeah. This has happened a couple of times the past, over the past year. Uh, it's like that is true. Joy. Yeah. Truly. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:48:43] Korie Griggs: Like, and it creates that just like. I don't know, like you really feel seen. You're like, oh, we are on the same wavelength.
Also, like literacy changes the world. So it's just like, okay, if we read more, we can be more in action, we can be in more conversation, we can be in community more. So that's what I'm all about.
[00:49:02] Michael Zarick: So what is the, if you, if you remember, if you don't, that's cool. Yeah. What is the like foundational book of your relationship?
[00:49:08] Korie Griggs: It was a book called How We Show Up by Mia Birdsong. And it's all about, um, re-imagining like what community and care looks like and outside of like creating family, like literally like choosing your family and what does it look like to create these systems that are actually sustainable. Um, versus like this, like, you have to like this person because they're your blood or whatever.
And it's like, no. Like we can actually give grace and show love and like. Reimagine and create more healthy spaces.
[00:49:41] Michael Zarick: Amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for sharing. So we're at Proof, A Midwest Lit Fest. Yeah. Can you tell me about what it means to you as a reader, as somebody who curates a collection of books, and especially is about sharing stories, what it means to have an event like this.
To come together and, and do that.
[00:50:00] Korie Griggs: Yeah. As so, I'm a writer as well. Ooh. So this event, uh, has always been like really encouraging just to my process as craft, as community, but also as a really beautiful space to like be a bookseller and like see and hear what people are reading. Like we were just talking that when people come through here, you're like, no.
Like they're really reading, you know, like they're really like engaging with books. They wanna know like what we love and why we love it. And so you get to like, I don't know, there's just more of a thread of community through it, and I think it's super necessary and hope that it continues for many, many years to come.
[00:50:36] Michael Zarick: Amazing. Yeah. Uh, anything else you wanna talk about?
[00:50:38] Korie Griggs: Um, support small spaces because small businesses need us. Like if you've thought about going to a space, just go, if it crosses your mind. Follow them. Go like, just support in any way, shape, or form, because the way that we go farther is together.
[00:50:56] Michael Zarick: uh, what you said is so true because that is where like true community is found when you can really connect with a business owner, with somebody who shares an interest with you. Mm-hmm. Somebody who is. Doing something that you want to do.
And similar to like the origin story of your business itself. Yeah. Is like, that is where real community is found and that is what will be our savior in a lot of ways. And so it is. And so and so it is, it is. I always say. And so it goes like, I'm Kurt Vonnegut. Love, you Korie uh, that with me and we'll, we'll connect later.
Awesome. Yeah. Well,
[00:51:32] Korie Griggs: thanks.
[00:51:33] Michael Zarick: Hey, I'm here with Lee Bennett. Lee Bennett is the volunteer coordinator at Indy Reads down there in Fountain Square, and we're actually good buddies. We've met before, but
[00:51:44] Lee Bennett: So true. Yeah.
[00:51:45] Michael Zarick: Uh. Lee, can you tell me a little bit about Indy Reads, our local OG bookstore and literacy organization?
[00:51:52] Lee Bennett: Yes. We are a local OG bookstore. Um, so we're also an adult literacy nonprofit, so all the proceeds from our bookstore, um, which is new and donated used books, go towards our adult literacy programs. So we offer, um. We serve adult learners who are reading and writing below a fifth grade level. We're the only organization in Indiana that offers that.
Uh, we also do high school equivalency classes, uh, for those that are looking to get their HSE certificate. And then we do our English language learning program and we go from the very beginning learners, whether you have a high literacy level in your native language or not, we can help you. Um, and then we also offer workforce development programs, paraprofessional certification.
Um, customer service certification. So we do a lot behind the scenes. Um, and we're, we're a beautiful bookstore too.
[00:52:43] Michael Zarick: Yeah. And if you want more information, information about Indy Reads, , Ruba Marshood the CEO of Indy Reads, that's been on my podcast, so you're lucky. I'll check out that episode. You're lucky.
[00:52:51] Lee Bennett: She's very busy lady. That's what they tell
[00:52:53] Michael Zarick: me. Um, so we're here at Proof A Midwest Lit Fest. Can you tell me what it means, uh, for your organization to be able to show up to an event like this that brings. Readers, writers and all these people together.
[00:53:07] Lee Bennett: Absolutely. So, um, whenever I meet new groups of volunteers, I always say, how many of you are readers?
And pretty much everyone raises their hand. So, um, it's, it's this, this event in particular is where everyone who understands the power of literacy is here. Everyone knows what words mean, what it means to be able to say what you wanna say, and for others to hear that. And that's really what we're all about, is, um, giving our students a voice, um, giving them the ability to express themselves, to participate in civic life, to be a part of our community fully.
So, um, everyone here is just, you know, so open to that message they would totally understand. And so it's great to be able to. Have people shop with us, hopefully have people volunteer with us and get them more involved in our organization.
[00:54:00] Michael Zarick: Rope them in. And you guys just started your, um, your new session.
Your new session of, of learning, yeah. Yeah. In September, right? Hasn't it been like pretty successful?
[00:54:08] Lee Bennett: Yes. Isn't there like a, we have had a huge response. We definitely, um, see a lot more need than we can fill. uh, all of our classes are full. And also I have heard that our student attrition LA rates are lower than ever.
So people are showing up, people are looking for our services and people are staying there. So we're really proud of our programming. Yeah.
[00:54:31] Michael Zarick: That's amazing.
[00:54:32] Lee Bennett: Yeah.
[00:54:33] Michael Zarick: Uh, Anna, do you have any questions?
What, what, how, how have you seen literacy build community and have an impact on. Have, have you seen literacy build community and have an impact on Indiana?
[00:54:46] Lee Bennett: On people?
[00:54:46] Michael Zarick: On people, on
[00:54:47] Lee Bennett: people? Oh my gosh, that question is almost like too big. Where do I even begin? Um,
[00:54:54] Michael Zarick: yeah, you wanted to spend an hour talking,
[00:54:56] Lee Bennett: I think.
Okay. This is how I'll answer that. I think the best thing that I see that literacy is able to do is. Put people in community. So really what we find out when we spend time with our students, when we start to hear what they have to say is how much we have in common. So, um, how much We're all just doing our best.
We're just trying to be good people. We're trying to get the best that we can out of life. And when you recognize the humanity in other people, that's what communication does. That's what listening does. Um, the world just becomes a better place. You understand why everyone deserves every opportunity and how we're all just here, we're in this together and we need to support each other.
So I think that like bringing people back to listening places, to storytelling places is where we can really see that, that humanity shine through.
[00:55:50] Michael Zarick: Amazing. This has been Lee Bennett and Indy Res. If you want to get involved with Indy Reads, you can go to indyreads.org/volunteer
and you can meet Lee Bennett yourself and she will guide you through all the steps.
It's super easy, super fun. And yeah, that's Indy Reads. Yeah. Uh, adult Literacy Organization, not just the bookstore. Keep that in mind. That's right.
[00:56:11] Lee Bennett: Thanks for having me. Yeah, absolutely.
[00:56:13] Michael Zarick: Thanks. Thanks, Lee.
[00:56:14] Track 3: Hey, a huge shout out to Indiana Humanities and proof of Midwest Lit Fest, year 2, 20 25. I'm really appreciative that they invited me. I had a great time walking around for a couple of hours, getting to talk to some of the local business owners. I didn't record an onscreen outro, but I've got this. I wish I had gotten a little more time with some of the writers and poets that were there, but I'll save that for next year.
I'm also looking forward to next year, 'cause I know it's gonna be bigger. I know there's gonna be more talks I want to attend and I hope to spend even more time with the local humanities community here in Indianapolis. Thanks so much for listening, and I really hope you listen to the next one. Have a great day.