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Intro

Introduction paragraph

Can be found here:

• Links to listen

• Links of references from the show

• Production learnings

• Story Time

• Episode Summary

• Episode Transcript

Third Space Indy is supported by:

• City Rising

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Important links and mentions

• Auboni’s Instagram

• That Peace Open Mic

Third Space Indy is supported by:

• City Rising

Episode Summary

Host Michael Zarick interviews Indianapolis poet Auboni Hart (Auboni Essence) about performing writing, creating community “third places,” and her evolving pride in Naptown. They discuss how stage performance adds emotion and meaning beyond the page, Auboni’s rehearsal process, and her work with That Peace Open Mic, which she joined in 2017 and says has adapted through COVID with virtual shows and more spacing at in-person events. Auboni shares how she shifted from disliking Indianapolis to intentionally seeing its beauty, highlighting local bookstores, events, and favorite food spots. She describes a third space as somewhere you can show up without an expectation to spend money. Auboni also explains forming a one-off band for her Naptones award-show performance, being named a 2026 Art & Soul artist, and she performs her poem “Let Me Down Easy.”

Third Space Indy is supported by City Rising (cityrising.org)

00:00 What Is Performing
00:40 Intro
01:08 Meeting Auboni
04:47 Why Perform Poetry
07:37 Repping Indianapolis
12:47 Finding Your Community
14:54 Forming A One Off Band
18:34 That Peace Open Mic Origins
20:53 COVID And Open Mic Changes
30:07 Do I Get Art
35:05 Third Space Definition
36:52 Paying For Community
39:04 Values Over Convenience
39:38 Third Space Not Transaction
40:50 Lost Third Spaces
42:42 Childhood Porch Nostalgia
45:22 Ocean Versus Space
47:46 Space Curiosity Not Colonizing
50:20 Art and Soul Spotlight
53:03 Performing Writing Live
56:55 Feedback And Sensitivity
59:48 Poem: Let Me Down Easy
01:04:25 Freedom Reimagined Question
01:07:45 Where To Find Auboni
01:09:23 Final Thanks And Credits

Episode Transcript

Auboni Essence

[00:00:00] Michael Zarick: what does it mean to like, perform?

[00:00:01] Auboni Essence: Oh, what an excellent question.

Like performance I guess for me just means being able to, to read or recite my work. And, and shout out to my friends because I have gotten up in the middle of the living room and just been like, can I reach out this thing? And my one friend was like, oh, no, I'm scared. And I was like, why? What are you scared for?

[00:00:40] Michael Zarick: Hey, my name is Michael Zarick and this is Third Space Indy. In 1989, a man named Ray Oldenberg wrote a book called The Great Good Place.

And in this book, he coined the term, the third place. This describes somewhere outside of your home and outside of your work that you can go be with others and build community together. And so I've made it my goal to find people all over Indianapolis who are doing their very best to create these types of spaces.

[00:01:06] Auboni Essence: Very cool.

[00:01:08] Michael Zarick: So today, uh, I'm joined by Auboni Hart, AKA Auboni Essence. And as we just discussed, just Auboni.

[00:01:16] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:01:17] Michael Zarick: So first of all, how are you doing?

[00:01:19] Auboni Essence: I'm doing really well. I feel really good. It's a nice Friday. It's a little chilly, but it's warm in here.

[00:01:25] Michael Zarick: Yeah. So

[00:01:25] Auboni Essence: that's good.

[00:01:25] Michael Zarick: I was hoping it was gonna be, so I walked here from like the very tippity bottom of Mass Ave.

And I was hoping the sun would be out, but I was like a little chilly walking up here. Mm-hmm. but that's okay. I feel good now. And a little sweaty, ignore that. Hmm. So the way connected is maybe not the right word, but I'm gonna use it. Um, the way you and I connected it is because I attended, um, Sam Ferrante's

[00:01:54] Auboni Essence: Real Life Revised,

[00:01:55] Michael Zarick: well I was gonna say her, her literary, what, what was the term we

[00:01:58] Auboni Essence: used?

I, I use literary open mic.

[00:01:59] Michael Zarick: Literary open mic called Real Life Revised.

[00:02:01] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:02:01] Michael Zarick: And I sat and listened to every single person who was there, and there were some amazing people there that night. But that also included yourself who did a performance of, I think a short poem. Yeah. Uh, and it really connected with me.

And I sent you a message afterwards, and I apologize for not remembering exactly what the poem was about, but I do remember how it made me feel.

[00:02:22] Auboni Essence: Mm. How did it make you feel?

[00:02:23] Michael Zarick: if I recall correctly, uh, there was like a sort of a sense of like longing or like a sense of, what's the word I'm looking for?

Nostalgia associated with it. and I just remember being like, this person's cool. And then I started looking at your, uh, Instagram page and I was like, oh, this person's like very Indianapolis.

[00:02:47] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:02:48] Michael Zarick: And that's like the exact type of person I'm trying to talk to.

[00:02:51] Auboni Essence: That's dope. Well, thank you.

[00:02:52] Michael Zarick: So in your own words

[00:02:54] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:02:54] Michael Zarick: Can you. Share with the people who you are Yeah. And what you do.

[00:02:58] Auboni Essence: Yeah. So I'm Auboni Essence, um, when I am performing. So I am a poet local to Indianapolis. I believe in everything Naptown. When I'm outside of my arts scene, arts world, I'm just Auboni Hart, um, a communications and marketing professional. Um, and then if you're looking for the person that sits in between, then I am just Auboni.

Um, I am a human being who loves people and seeks to inspire, to touch, to heal, and, um, to provide a little bit of hope as well as recognition to individuals who, uh, share space with me.

I wish I could remember what the poem was. I also was thinking about my term literary open mic, and that seems a little redundant 'cause aren't all open mics literary in some fashion. But I do think that putting that in front of open mic, uh, captures a little bit of what Sam is trying to get, which is she doesn't just want poets, she wants essayists and storytellers and all this other stuff.

And I feel like I've heard like a poetry open mic before, like, so it doesn't feel too off kilter, does it?

[00:04:09] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Well she also was like, Michael, do you wanna do like a five minute podcast? I was like, I would think about it. Yeah. Um, performing, I'm, so tomorrow I'm doing my very first like, live podcast recording who's to say who shows up?

Wow. But like, there's an, there's something about, um, sitting down one-on-one.

[00:04:29] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:04:30] Michael Zarick: You know, even though there's someone in the room with us Yeah. But there's something down one-on-one and like, uh, sharing space together. Yeah. Um, that I think is. Like there's an intimacy to it that's like there, but then like when you bring in other people, how does that affect the output?

I think that's interesting. Um, and I think there's a question of like, actually I was thinking about this on the way over here. Like, why do you enjoy performing your writing?

[00:04:58] Auboni Essence: Um, because a lot of it needs to be performed. Um, I write, I write differently. I write for the page, I write for the stage. But when you're writing for the stage, you have to perform.

It, it, like, you can read it, but there is a, there is an element that is missing when you don't get to see the, for lack of better term. Theatrics around the poem. I have, I have a poem called, is Your Pussy Worth $5,000? that if you were to read that poem, I still think it would be very evocative, but when you see me perform it, there is an added layer of connection and understanding that I believe it can get lost on the page.

Mm-hmm. I'm not saying that it's impossible to convey that, but I do think that it's more probable to have those elements, um, fall through the cracks.

[00:05:58] Michael Zarick: That makes sense. I, I recall, this is like a really random memory, memory that just hit me. Um, a friend of mine wrote a poem in high school, and like sent me a recording of her reading it.

[00:06:09] Auboni Essence: Cool.

[00:06:10] Michael Zarick: And then I. Recorded myself reading it and sent it to her. And she goes, I like the way you read it better. Like, it like hit differently, um, when I read it back to her. And I think there was that sort of interesting like, dynamic of like performance

[00:06:23] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:06:23] Michael Zarick: As you say, where it's like the way you convey the words on the page through tonality or like, um, something you're, or even body movement.

Yeah. Like I think there's a lot there that's interesting. An interesting thing I didn't think about immediately.

[00:06:39] Auboni Essence: Yeah, absolutely. Um, there are like, I was in real practices and we were reading poems, sad, reading them mad, reading them funny, picking out the elements that made it sense for different lines and piecemealing it together so that we had something that, um, felt more complete and conveyed the correct emotions that we were looking for.

[00:07:01] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:07:01] Auboni Essence: Throughout the entire way.

[00:07:03] Michael Zarick: So where in Indianapolis are you from?

[00:07:05] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Um, the northwest side. So you know, the library, the newest. Maybe library off Michigan Road.

[00:07:14] Michael Zarick: Yes.

[00:07:15] Auboni Essence: Yes. I go across the street from like an Ace Lock and Key and yeah. Yeah. So I grew up in that neighborhood, so behind there.

[00:07:21] Michael Zarick: Okay. What high school did you go to?

[00:07:22] Auboni Essence: North Central,

[00:07:23] Michael Zarick: yo. Okay, cool. Everyone I know who went to North Central

[00:07:26] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:07:27] Michael Zarick: Is like really cool.

[00:07:29] Auboni Essence: Shout out to the Panthers. That's all I gotta say. That's

[00:07:32] Michael Zarick: funny. Um,

I don't even know why I was just interested more than anything else. what about Indianapolis? Like compels you to want to rep and perform and as you say, heal and share?

[00:07:45] Auboni Essence: Mm. Well, I mean, keep it a be, you know, 'cause there are gonna be be people who gonna call me out on this and that's fine. I did not like being from here for a really, really long time.

And I would say that this newfound love is, um. Three to five years old, um, to be honest. Mm-hmm. I've, I've only ever lived here. I've only ever experienced what Indianapolis is like, and I had a type of upbringing that instilled in me to not like Indianapolis. Like everywhere I would go, I would just find myself around people who did not like Indianapolis.

And so then fast forward to three to five years ago, and I was finding really cool people. I mean really if we go back eight years is where I found Mariah through That Peace Open Mic. And she's one of the coolest Indianapolis natives that I know of. Um, and so she was introducing me to the art scene and I was getting to see, um, I was getting to see more of a reason to stick around.

Um, fast forward a few years after that and I was finally feeling like I was finding people who were proud to be from Indianapolis. And that was, um. Like truly mind shifting, mind body shifting of finding people who were actually like, yeah, like we understand Indianapolis has its downfall, downfalls, but like also here's some really cool things.

And how cool would it be for you to also say that you're a part of these cool things instead of just hating on this city. Like, show the city some love. What you put into the city is what you get out of the city. And I was like, okay, cool, cool, cool. And so it's been like a journey of um, being intentional about seeing the beauty of Indianapolis instead of slipping back into what honestly, most of my childhood was.

Um, I just, I have very vivid memories of like friends or even family members saying like, I hate it here and I can't wait to leave and while I wanna leave because I've never seen anything else outside of Indianapolis. Like, I would not leave and be like, oh yeah, nah. F my city. Like, I would be like, no, you have to go.

And here's, here's a list of places actually that you should go. Um, I love to take people to food places. I understand that. We might not think that they're really good food place places in Indianapolis.

[00:10:04] Michael Zarick: There's a lot, I promise.

[00:10:05] Auboni Essence: There's so many. There's so many. Like, I think, what's that called? Like Tinker Street or something like that?

Mm-hmm. One of them really great. I love Chin Family Restaurant on the south side. I love Yaso and Fountain Square. Oh

[00:10:17] Michael Zarick: my God,

[00:10:18] Auboni Essence: bro. Like Tlaolli on East Washington Street. Um, Jollof Buka on West Washington Street, three in one on West 86th Street. Listen list 'em off. I was like, I like, I like to eat food. Um, and so to come back full circle to what you're saying of just like instilling and inspiring and uplifting and healing is like, I think that there's, there's a brokenness that, um, some of our Naptown natives are experiencing that makes them feel this.

Very real and very valid, like anger or disconnect or discontent with the city that needs to be poured into and loved and healed because, 'cause you can leave, you know, everybody can do what they wanna do in this world, but if you're not leaving and you're staying, then complaining about the problem isn't gonna do anything if you're not willing to be the change that you wanna see.

So, um, so that's just kind of where it, it, it goes for my Naptown natives as well as like, we're all humans and we're going through something and my work really tries to like, touch on, again, recognizing, and by recognizing, I mean seeing those people who are going through those things and letting them know that they're not alone or letting them know that there is a way that you can heal or there's a way that you can express there's a way that you can be, um, that isn't destructive to yourself or others.

[00:11:43] Michael Zarick: That's beautiful.

[00:11:44] Auboni Essence: Thanks.

[00:11:45] Michael Zarick: Yeah, I, there's this like perspective I think people have. Um, or don't have because they haven't lived somewhere else. Um, I'm blessed to have lived in a number of different places.

[00:11:55] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:11:56] Michael Zarick: Um, and I think that gives me a unique advantage in moving here. Mm-hmm. Where I can say, here's how Indianapolis is different.

And that's why I like it.

[00:12:06] Auboni Essence: That's cool.

[00:12:07] Michael Zarick: Um, and that's part of the reason I started doing this podcast. 'cause I like really like it here. Um, but there's a lot of privilege that comes with being able to like, like we were talking about earlier, like

[00:12:18] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:12:19] Michael Zarick: Like fuck off in the middle of the day, like to be at Loudmouth Books and like sit down with someone and talk.

[00:12:24] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:12:24] Michael Zarick: Um, you know, not everyone has that ability.

[00:12:27] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:12:27] Michael Zarick: Um, but like, putting yourself out in the community, like you said, like going to meet like-minded creatives or just somebody who has a shared interest with you Yeah. Can really just lighten up. A place that would otherwise feel dark or lame.

[00:12:44] Auboni Essence: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Exactly. Yeah. So really putting that information out there. I like to pub all of my favorite places like Ujaama Bookstore, Loudmouth Bookstore, um, That Peace Open Mic, of course. Anything that DJ Grapevine, DJ Bay, Brooke Billions, DJ Sounds by Cam. Any events that they're putting on, I love to just go to and be in the space.

Um, yeah, like my, I went, I'm going way back. I went to a very large church and my first lady used to always say that a big church feels small when you get involved and Indianapolis is already like a big city, like small town vibes. And so all you have to do is really get involved and you'll begin to see that, oh yeah, like we went to this event, or I saw you at that event.

And there is a real community, but it takes for us to go to the things and exemplify how important it is to us in order for. A Carmel, a Greenwood in Illinois in Ohio, a Texas a Brazil, to see how really cool and important it is, period. Full stop.

[00:13:54] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:13:55] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:13:55] Michael Zarick: There's like a, this analogy I like to use with, uh, in relation to IU Bloomington, a lot of my, like high school people I know from Louisville where I'm from, um, would talk about a school like IU Bloomington, which is a large school.

[00:14:10] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:11] Michael Zarick: Um, saying like, it's too big for me. Um, but I would always use the analogy of like, it's like an ocean.

[00:14:16] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:16] Michael Zarick: And you have to like find your school of fish.

[00:14:18] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:19] Michael Zarick: Like the people you want to hang out with. So I hung out with music students and like random sorority girls or whatever. Um, and then like, uh, the informatics or like computer science kids.

And it was like when you hang out with those smaller groups. Schools, literally and figuratively.

[00:14:33] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:33] Michael Zarick: Um, you found that like, it wasn't as intimidating or large as it seemed, it was just like putting yourself

[00:14:39] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:40] Michael Zarick: In the position to, um, find your, uh, people always use tribe. I think that's probably out of favor in terms of like terminology, but like

[00:14:48] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:48] Michael Zarick: Something like you're just a group of people you like being around.

[00:14:52] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:14:52] Michael Zarick: Um, I love hearing that from you. speaking of a group of friends. Yeah. I, we were gonna have this discussion. So you're going later today?

[00:15:00] Auboni Essence: Yes. Later today

[00:15:02] Michael Zarick: to practice

[00:15:03] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:15:03] Michael Zarick: With a group of people who play music together.

[00:15:05] Auboni Essence: Yes. What is your definition of a band?

[00:15:10] Michael Zarick: I think I just said it.

[00:15:12] Auboni Essence: Group of people who play music together. Yeah.

[00:15:14] Michael Zarick: Um,

[00:15:15] Auboni Essence: yeah.

[00:15:15] Michael Zarick: What's the name of that band?

[00:15:16] Auboni Essence: We don't have a name. It's just my friends.

[00:15:20] Michael Zarick: Today's the time to have that discussion. Uh, so tell me about like how you came into this situation.

[00:15:30] Auboni Essence: So I, my, um, my partner and just really good friend, we started off as really good friends.

His name is Troy Freeman. He, um, AKA Mr. Troy Track Select, um, spearheaded the nav tones. And the nav tones is an Indiana music award ceremony. It's just for the state of Indiana. And last year, uh, was its first year. This year is, its second year and I am performing. So I performed last year as the, um, like intermission.

So anytime we were switching from announcing awards for like best rap, hip hop, single and album to Best Rock, um, I would get up there and I would perform. And so he asked me to perform again this year and I said, okay, cool. I'll figure something out. Um. This year though, it's expanded to where we have other Indiana acts performing as well.

So it won't just be me, I just have my own segment, which I think is beautiful. It is, um, blossoming into what an individual would think about from a, um, an award ceremony perspective. You know, you watch the Grammys, they'll have GloRilla coming down, you know, from the sky. And so while we won't have people coming down from the sky, we'll have different performances.

Um, and so like that's a little bit of the backstory. How, of how we got here, where I was like, okay, this is a new poem that I wanna do, but I wrote it to a song by Cleo Soul and I want, um, I wanted the man to just play that instrumental, but I also wanted vocalists to sing the mantra that she has in this song.

And I was like, okay, cool. There is a house band already, but the house band doesn't have a piano player.

[00:17:12] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:17:13] Auboni Essence: That's fine. I'll find a piano player. There's a houseman. But the houseman doesn't have vocal list, and that's fine. I'll just find some vocalists. So I literally just texted a few friends and was like, Hey, this is what I'm thinking.

Would you be down? This is how much I can pay. And they said, yeah. And I said, great. Rehearsal is Friday.

[00:17:32] Michael Zarick: So you formed a band

[00:17:34] Auboni Essence: Yeah. For this one piece. That

[00:17:35] Michael Zarick: giving for this one thing.

[00:17:36] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:17:39] Michael Zarick: What is your definition of a band?

[00:17:40] Auboni Essence: My definition of a band is a group of, um, musicians and vocalists who come together to perform or play, play, perform, practice the, the three Ps.

[00:17:56] Michael Zarick: So are you for, are you performing?

[00:18:02] Auboni Essence: We're performing on the nap at the nap zones together.

[00:18:05] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:18:05] Auboni Essence: Yeah. And we'll be practicing tonight and playing both those times.

[00:18:10] Michael Zarick: We need, there's gonna be a name discussion happening.

[00:18:13] Auboni Essence: but Will, but, but will this specific band come around again to be determined?

[00:18:21] Michael Zarick: Who's to say bands cannot be amorphous, just like, uh,

[00:18:26] Auboni Essence: very strict people.

I'm not one of those people. Uh,

[00:18:30] Michael Zarick: I appreciate you having me, that discussion with me.

[00:18:32] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:18:32] Michael Zarick: Um, so when you talk about,

[00:18:34] Auboni Essence: we got

[00:18:34] Michael Zarick: it. That, That Peace Open Mic.

[00:18:35] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:18:36] Michael Zarick: There we go. I got there. Uh, I actually don't, I haven't attended one. Oh, you should come, but this is, it's large. Yeah. Uh, the last one I know about was at the White Rabbit. Um, but that was a while ago.

[00:18:46] Auboni Essence: Ooh, I don't know if we've been at the White Rabbit. Um, am

[00:18:49] Michael Zarick: I crazy?

[00:18:50] Auboni Essence: Yeah, I don't know if we've ever been at the White Rabbit. If we were then, it might've been an end of year show. Mm-hmm. My family moved to Texas. Mm-hmm. And so I'm not usually here in December. Um, but I know that right now we're at 10 East Arts as like our home base right now. Yeah. It happens every third Thursday.

Um, we've been just carving out space for people to come, um, of art, all artists, uh, genres to come. So last month we had, actually, it's still March this month. We had a comedian. We had some MCs, but we, uh, we predominantly have a lot of poets. Mm-hmm. And that's, it's the space.

[00:19:24] Michael Zarick: You're one of the organizers.

[00:19:25] Auboni Essence: Yeah. I'm one of the, uh, organizers. It's me, Mariah Ivy, and Dae Mansfield, who is a phenomenal vocalist. Just dropped a single, by the way, should listen to it. It's called Drive. It's really good.

[00:19:37] Michael Zarick: Um, so why did you get involved with. The creation of that space.

[00:19:44] Auboni Essence: Ooh. So, um, 30 year feel

[00:19:47] Michael Zarick: like that's a question.

[00:19:47] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Third year anniversary show for That Peace Open Mic was actually at the downtown library in the sitter, in the Center for Black Literature and Culture, and I went, this was my first time ever going and I had the best time ever. Fast forward a couple months and RA was like, alright, you know, I'm looking to expand the team who wants to be a apart?

I said, me, me. And so I went and we like officially formed in October of 2017 and I've been rocking with them ever since.

[00:20:21] Michael Zarick: That's almost a decade.

[00:20:22] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:20:24] Michael Zarick: Okay. I was, I shared a map of Indianapolis Yeah. Of downtown parking.

[00:20:28] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:20:29] Michael Zarick: Um, the other day on Instagram. Yeah. And someone messaged me, messaged me and they go, this is an old map.

And I was like, it's from 2012. That's not that old. And they were like, that was 13

[00:20:36] Auboni Essence: years ago. And

[00:20:37] Michael Zarick: I was like, oh God. Uh. So I found a more recent one, but that's like, it took the phrase like, I've been doing this open mic act.

[00:20:46] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:20:46] Michael Zarick: And you said that was the third?

[00:20:47] Auboni Essence: That was the third year anniversary. Yeah. So we are coming up on 11 years this July.

[00:20:51] Michael Zarick: That's crazy.

[00:20:52] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:20:53] Michael Zarick: Um, how have you seen it evolve over that time?

[00:20:58] Auboni Essence: Um,

[00:20:58] Michael Zarick: have you Oh, also like in the middle of it was COVID.

[00:21:03] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:21:03] Michael Zarick: How has, have you seen COVID impact that, that, I'm gonna call it community space. Yeah. Like, it's interesting to think about like community spaces from pre and post COVID perspective.

Yes.

[00:21:16] Auboni Essence: Yes. So pre COVID, um, I'll say that there were honestly just, there were a, a lot more individuals because there was just this culture, this understanding of like, it's okay for us to be in a room crowded, like shoulder to shoulder next to each other. COVID happens. We are doing all of our shows virtually spec, like specifically like Instagram live.

Like we're just giving people a show of sorts, like, um, sharing, sharing screen with people so they can come in and do something and spit a verse and like, that's how we were doing stuff like every other month. And then post COVID, um, you could just really tell that in-person events across the world were impacted and that fewer people were okay being shoulder to shoulder.

Like even now as we are like. Four or five, six years removed from the shutdown. I, I notice the extra steps people take to keep their distance from other people. And so with that, uh, we don't have, um, well we, we switch spaces, so that's cool. But we also try to switch spaces to accommodate for more space.

and so we still have a very thriving and loving and supportive, supportive audience. And so I love that. I, um, I don't think that's what a lot of spaces can say. You know, COVID did a member on a lot of, a lot of community spaces and so we are very grateful that people are still coming out and letting us know that they want this space and it's valuable to them.

But I just, I don't see, like, when I remember the library, I just remember again like pe me having to be like, all right, excuse me, excuse me.

[00:23:00] Michael Zarick: You're like pushing people outta the way,

[00:23:02] Auboni Essence: you know? And now it's like people are taking as many precautions as possible to just not be as close physically. Mm-hmm. In a public space.

And so I think that's what I've noticed the most. And I don't think it's like wise of me to be like, just touch your neighbor. Like, I do think that I want to encourage people to still go outside though. Um. Take the extra precautions and safety that make you feel comfortable. We don't mask shame at TPON.

If you wanna show up with a mask, you can do so. We've had people do that. Um, if you want, if you, if it starts to get a little bit uncomfortable and you need to take some time, you wanna actually go outside, like you have the space to do the things that make you feel comfortable, but we also wanna see you, we wanna say, what's up?

We wanna give you a little fist bump elbow or just two fingers. Like whatever is comfortable. Yeah. Yeah. And so that's, that's kind of what I've seen. But again, throughout all of that, we've seen the love, we've seen the support, and we've seen people still show up in a way for us. And that has felt, um, just, it's made me feel just so warm and just crazy 'cause like, 'cause again, that, that is, that is what keeps us going.

[00:24:14] Michael Zarick: Have you seen the, the, the art or the performances itself? Change in tone also over the same period.

[00:24:23] Auboni Essence: I mean, yeah, but like in general, in the poetry space, it's like changed. So a decade ago was a lot of like, um, I'm thinking about like button poetry and other slam I, um, performances that would reenact things, right?

Like they would reenact what happened. And now I'm seeing things kind of shift to people are personifying the. Whatever the system or the, the thing that they're interrogating. So they become like, let's just take capitalism. They'll become a capitalist figure and say, yeah, I'm the reason that you do. But like 10 years ago it was, you know, I got bills to pay and I'm doing this.

It was, this is how it's impacting me. And now there's this switch of I'm now personifying the thing that is impacting. So you can see how dumb it is or how detrimental it is, or how aggressive it is, whatever the, the term is. Whatever it is that you want to get across to the listener.

[00:25:23] Michael Zarick: Yeah. There's this like concept in movies right now.

[00:25:26] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:25:26] Michael Zarick: Um, that I've seen a lot of discussion about, which is this idea of like post meta writing where it's like movies at some point. So like early two thousands you have like Lord of the Rings, which is like the most serious lived in world like fantasy ever. And then you get into this like. I'm trying to emulate Lord of the Rings, so I'm imitating what that is or I'm doing a commentary on it.

[00:25:54] Auboni Essence: Mm.

[00:25:54] Michael Zarick: And now we've entered this point of movies, which is like post meta commentary. So it's like commentary on the commentary, which is like its own weird

[00:26:03] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:26:04] Michael Zarick: Evolution of movie writing. And it's like, at what point does this collapse back to like, being super serious? Yeah. And like you're back to what Lord of the Rings was, which is like you're going full ass into like, I'm live living in this world versus like

[00:26:18] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:26:19] Michael Zarick: Um, doing commentary on

[00:26:21] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:26:22] Michael Zarick: The fantasy world and

[00:26:22] Auboni Essence: then commentary

[00:26:23] Michael Zarick: on the commentary and like what you described about poetry kind of makes me think of that, where it's like I've moved from, describing my own personal experience, something I've lived to doing almost meta commentary of mm-hmm. Like, uh, whatever system I'm.

Yeah, talking about. Does that make sense?

[00:26:43] Auboni Essence: It does. It does. And, and I would, I would agree. And, and I think that all things are like cyclical. I'd be interested to see if there's something else that branches off from this. Um, but I think that it'll probably just follow that cycle for a little while of just like being, coming from perspective to like this meta commentary to perspective, to commentary now from the movies.

I don't know. Um, I'm, I know that I'm more, uh, I lean more towards original movies. That is what brings me in most That is what brings me in the most is just original works or, um, I'm okay with like, movies that are adapted from books. Um, one of the. Movies. The movies that I end up seeing are always movies that I didn't know were gonna be sad. And so like, um, and so, so, um, this years ago, 'cause I was in high school, but I took my, my mom and my partner at the time to see if I stay, which nobody knows about because it's one of those just original niche movies.

But it's about a, a young girl who's a celloist and her and her parents are like on this back icy, snowy back road in some forest. And they're driving and this truck comes and like, runs them off the road. Basically. Parents don't make it. She's in a coma. She's a renowned cellist. Okay. She, I think they were arguing about how like, um, she feels so pressured and something, something, and then the rest of the movie.

Is answering the question like, is she gonna stay? Is she gonna go? I don't know. And like, I didn't know it was gonna be any of that. Okay. I thought it was gonna be like, okay, we just see what happens after she emerges from said accident. Okay. No. The entire movie is like, we're flashing in and out of being in her brain, um, because she can kind of hear what's going on with her family.

And so she's like living in this world, in her brain, but it's not really making sense. And she knows it's not making sense, but it's making enough sense to make her wanna stay in her brain. But like, her family's just like, no, you need to stay in reality. And then it ends, the movie ends with like a zooming in on her eyes.

And then they just opened and we don't know if they opened in her brain or opened in real life. And then it just like fades. It doesn't even fade to black. It just cuts to black. I was so upset and my like, and my partner and my mom were bawling right next to me and I was like, I didn't know it was gonna be this.

I promise. Like there was so many heartfelt moments. It was like, what did, it was her grandpa finally came to see her in the hospital. 'cause he hadn't seen her the whole movie and was just like, listen, like I don't got nobody else. Your mom is gone, your dad is gone. Your, your grandma's gone. You all I got.

And like, that's what did it for them. And I was just sitting there like, dang, that was real heartfelt. Like, and then Marley and Me, have you seen Marley and Me? Yeah. I didn't know that that was gonna be sad. Is

[00:29:39] Michael Zarick: it? I I'm not like a crier. Like I don't feel

[00:29:42] Auboni Essence: it's

[00:29:43] Michael Zarick: okay. Like actually this is, I'm interested in your, uh.

Oh, I have a follow up statement on this for sure. But like, Marley and Me does not have the effect on me that maybe it does on other people.

[00:29:54] Auboni Essence: That's good. It had me, my grandma,

[00:29:58] Michael Zarick: my

[00:29:58] Auboni Essence: great aunt.

[00:29:59] Michael Zarick: Oh, that's

[00:29:59] Auboni Essence: Balling.

[00:30:00] Michael Zarick: Yeah. Also, I can't take Owen Wilson seriously, and I'm pretty sure he's in that movie, but

[00:30:04] Auboni Essence: yeah. Well, you know, he did good to me.

[00:30:07] Michael Zarick: Um, yeah, there's this, I, I've been thinking about this a lot, like,

[00:30:10] Auboni Essence: yeah.

[00:30:11] Michael Zarick: And maybe I'm wrong because part of the reason I'm talking to you is because you had an effect on me, but I feel like sometimes I don't get art. Mm. Where I'm like, I don't know. It didn't make me feel like sometimes I'll go to like a, like a art opening at a studio, um, here locally or go to a first Friday thing and people are like, so enveloped in like a painting or a drawing or poetry or whatever, and I'm like, I don't think I get it.

Does that make sense?

[00:30:38] Auboni Essence: It does make sense. And I think that, um, like my initial response to that is like, you just haven't found the art that. Resonates with you. Um, that's my initial response to that. 'cause there are pieces that I've seen, honestly, you know, Harrison Center's first Friday that I'm like, okay, this is nice.

Yeah, this is cool. And then there are pieces that I'm like, oh wow. Um, there was this one artist who was painting parts of the West side and because I'd been on that side of town, it had, and I live over there right now, I'm like, wow. Like, no, I drive by this. I interact with this. Like this is pulling me. Um, there was an artist who was capturing this, just the weight of being a black woman in America.

And like that resonates with me. Um, you just have to find, 'cause I think that art is for everybody. Mm-hmm. And I think that everybody is an artist despite what everybody else feels about that statement. you just have to find what resonates with you and that is going to shift as you progress in this world and progress in life.

[00:31:39] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:31:40] Auboni Essence: Um. And so what resonates with you today, quite literally might not resonate with you tomorrow mm-hmm. Based on what happened that day,

[00:31:47] Michael Zarick: you know?

[00:31:47] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:31:47] Michael Zarick: And maybe the things I, uh, that do connect with me, I'm maybe not considering I'm doing like, some personal reflection in this moment, some things that I, that do connect with me and maybe I don't immediately consider art.

Mm. So, for example, uh, at New Fields, there's this painting

[00:32:05] Auboni Essence: mm-hmm.

[00:32:05] Michael Zarick: Of downtown Indianapolis. Mm-hmm. In like the early 1900s. There's like, uh, there's street cars, there's horses, there's people, uh, and it's sort of like paint literally paints this picture of a world we don't live in anymore. Yeah. Which is like very, um, walkable and local and connected.

Um, you know, there's a little, it's a, there's a grunge to it, I think. In, in the modern times that wouldn't necessarily look the same. Mm-hmm. Like the mud covered streets or whatever.

[00:32:39] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:39] Michael Zarick: Um, but like there's like a yearning that I feel when I look at that painting where it's like

[00:32:44] Auboni Essence: mm-hmm.

[00:32:45] Michael Zarick: We could have this.

[00:32:46] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:46] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:47] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:47] Michael Zarick: Uh, or like, I saw a picture of, um, a photo I should say of the A Monon train.

[00:32:55] Auboni Essence: Cool.

[00:32:56] Michael Zarick: Going down the Monon Trail.

[00:32:57] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:32:58] Michael Zarick: Uh, or what was was the Monon train line? Monon. Yeah. Uh, and I was like, that's sick. Yeah. So I was like, screw bikes. Like I, I use the Monon all the time, but it's like, why don't we still have that?

[00:33:09] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:33:09] Michael Zarick: Um, so you could, if I were to like say maybe I'm just like not thinking about that thing in the moment as like art, but that's really what it is.

[00:33:16] Auboni Essence: Yeah. That's exactly what it is. Yeah. There's two things to that. One, we don't have that blame Ford. My history teacher told me that Ford like lobbied and convinced so many government agencies to like pull up their train tracks.

And that's like why we're here. Um, if that's inaccurate. Blame my history teacher or my memory, you know?

[00:33:36] Michael Zarick: No, I mean there's definitely a lot of lobbying that happens with cars and stuff.

[00:33:39] Auboni Essence: And then the second thing is like, I would like to encourage you to explore this, um, the overall theme of desire, but as you narrow it down, your.

Um, like, not like attachment, but this recurring feeling of longing or yearning. Mm. Because you've said that to me a couple times today.

[00:34:03] Michael Zarick: Mm.

And

[00:34:04] Auboni Essence: I feel like that that's the space that you're in. And so I want you to interrogate that and investigate that further through artwork, through writing, through reading what is pulling you, what calls out to you.

You've already expressed this sense of, feels like it's transit oriented, to be honest. Don't get me started on that. But yeah, just, um, exploring, exploring that. And then the very last thing, and I'll probably text this to you, but the very last thing is I then want you to activate your imagination, right?

Because you're longing for something that I'm assuming you don't have. So then what does it look like for you to have that?

[00:34:43] Michael Zarick: Mm,

[00:34:43] Auboni Essence: and like, and share. You can share whatever you want or nothing at all. And then come

[00:34:47] Michael Zarick: to that piece of, would mind

[00:34:49] Auboni Essence: and share. You already know.

[00:34:53] Michael Zarick: Hashtag ad. Um, we're gonna move on to what I call the canned questions.

[00:35:00] Auboni Essence: Oh, okay. Cool.

[00:35:01] Michael Zarick: You did listen to a full podcast or no?

[00:35:03] Auboni Essence: No, not a full podcast.

[00:35:04] Michael Zarick: Okay. That's

[00:35:04] Auboni Essence: okay. Okay.

[00:35:05] Michael Zarick: Third Space Indy is sponsored by City Rising. City Rising is a social impact studio that leads and supports innovative projects that strengthen, celebrate and repair people and places.

City Rising is sponsored to question, which is what is a Third Space to you?

[00:35:22] Auboni Essence: Oh, um, Third Space is a space you can go to where you don't have to spend any money. That's like a Third Space. Um, I do think that there's a lot of, um, maybe I'll coin fourth spaces where you can go and there is like a cover, but the Third Space is the one where you can just show up. And so that's why I wanted to be intentional about attending a space where we could just be here today.

And so Loudmouth is that space. Um, Ujamaa is that space for me. Um, and yes, there is still like they would like you to buy books, right? Um, but Loudmouth also has a book club and you can come and you can connect with people. You don't really have to buy the book. You just have to have the book. And thanks to the Libby app, which is free, you can get the book.

Um, and so that's, that's like what a Third Space is to me. And I don't think that there, um, as plentiful as I would like them to be. One And two, I think that due to capitalism we are, we are like full speed ahead, going towards this like, um, community space, uh, that you have to pay for. Like we're, we're, we are normalizing the need to have to pay for community.

I just wrote a new poem that touches on that briefly.

[00:36:44] Michael Zarick: Only briefly.

[00:36:45] Auboni Essence: Yeah, only briefly. It's like two lines.

[00:36:50] Michael Zarick: Like a hi, not a haiku. Just distinctive. I think there's, I have more than two lines of thought on that. That's okay.

[00:36:56] Auboni Essence: Let's get into it.

[00:36:59] Michael Zarick: Yeah. I, talking about this live is really hard and I do think writing is an excellent way to express that because it allows you to really sit with your thoughts mm-hmm.

On this type of thing. But, I think there's this sort of, um, balance that I try to strike in my own thinking about free space because we do live under a capitalist society. Supporting spaces like Loudmouth books

[00:37:26] Auboni Essence: mm-hmm.

[00:37:27] Michael Zarick: With purchases is important.

[00:37:28] Auboni Essence: It

[00:37:28] Michael Zarick: is. But in an ideal world, you wouldn't need to do that.

[00:37:34] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:37:35] Michael Zarick: For, for a place like Loudmouth and others to exist.

[00:37:38] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Um. Yeah.

[00:37:41] Michael Zarick: And I think that comes down to certain, uh, infrastructure issues in terms of like taxation and stuff like that.

[00:37:46] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:37:46] Michael Zarick: Um, but I totally agree with you in terms of like, I, I always use the term, um, like it shouldn't be re uh, it shouldn't be it, you shouldn't feel compelled to spend money when you go into a space.

[00:38:04] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:38:04] Michael Zarick: You know, this is what you're talking about in terms of like spending money, like

[00:38:07] Auboni Essence: mm-hmm.

[00:38:07] Michael Zarick: Yes, it's great to come in and support Loudmouth books, but if I walk in and there, there's an expectation to spend money when, oh, expectation is the word I was looking for. Mm-hmm.

[00:38:15] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:38:16] Michael Zarick: Um, then it, the dynamic changes mm-hmm.

A lot. Mm-hmm.

[00:38:20] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:38:21] Michael Zarick: Um,

[00:38:21] Auboni Essence: it feels like I actually can't just be here.

[00:38:23] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:38:24] Auboni Essence: Yeah. I like. Yeah, like I'm, I'm, I'm personally less inclined to, to go to spaces where if I go the first time, it feels like I have to, I have to spend money. Like I will not name this coffee company, but there was a coffee company where I went in and I just asked for the bathroom code.

[00:38:42] Michael Zarick: I'm, I know what coffee company and I will not also comment on that.

[00:38:46] Auboni Essence: And I did not patron them for two and a half years because of that. That was a very negative experience. You don't even know if I'm willing to spend money with you, I need to address a like bio need. And you are worried about a dollar.

[00:39:04] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:39:05] Auboni Essence: And I did not patron them for two and a half years for that. I am that type of person where I understand the value, uh, that I bring when I'm spending my money, when I am engaging with capitalism. 'cause we have to, and I believe that. If you demonstrate to me that you will not put the human first, then there is no need for me to support this organization.

So I did not do so. Mm-hmm. And the only reason that I ended up doing so is because of convenience.

[00:39:33] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:39:33] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:39:34] Michael Zarick: Can I augment your answer a little bit?

[00:39:36] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:39:36] Michael Zarick: See if you agree with me.

[00:39:37] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:39:38] Michael Zarick: A Third Space is a place where, uh, your relationship is not based on transaction.

[00:39:44] Auboni Essence: Yes. Get it up, clock it.

[00:39:50] Michael Zarick: That's a, that's a term I do like to use a lot.

[00:39:51] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm.

[00:39:52] Michael Zarick: Transaction, because I think a lot of our relationships are based in transactional relationships.

[00:39:56] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm. Um,

[00:39:57] Michael Zarick: you know, I only have a transactional relationship. I, I reference Calvin Fletcher a lot 'cause I really like Calvin Fletcher. Mm-hmm. Um, I think it's a wonderful space for the people who live in Fletcher Place.

[00:40:07] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:40:08] Michael Zarick: I would not call it my Third Space.

[00:40:11] Auboni Essence: Okay.

[00:40:11] Michael Zarick: Because I only, I will like walk in, I get coffee and I leave most of the time. Okay. Yeah. I would call that a transactional. I don't have, I don't know any of the baristas. I don't know the owner or anything like that. Yeah. Versus like, uh, Thieves in Broad Ripple.

I know all the baristas by name. I very

[00:40:26] Auboni Essence: cool.

[00:40:26] Michael Zarick: The owner knows me by name, where like that is a space where I have removed transaction from the importance of me existing there.

[00:40:34] Auboni Essence: Cool.

[00:40:35] Michael Zarick: Um,

[00:40:35] Auboni Essence: that would be Cleo's Bodega and Ujamaa for me. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:40:38] Michael Zarick: Exactly.

[00:40:39] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:40:39] Michael Zarick: Um, great. Next question.

[00:40:41] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:40:42] Michael Zarick: Amazing answer.

[00:40:43] Auboni Essence: Thank you.

[00:40:43] Michael Zarick: Great discussion.

[00:40:44] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:40:45] Michael Zarick: Uh,

the next question, which is related. What is a Third Space that has existed for you previously that no longer does?

[00:40:57] Auboni Essence: Oh man. Um hmm.

[00:41:05] Michael Zarick: Always a hard question.

[00:41:06] Auboni Essence: It is actually. Mm. Because like, I.

[00:41:10] Michael Zarick: Well, it's also interesting, sorry to interrupt your, your, your thought process, but like No, it's okay because you talked about feeling disconnected from the city despite living here

[00:41:18] Auboni Essence: all the time. Yeah. I was like, yeah.

[00:41:20] Michael Zarick: Did you even have one?

[00:41:21] Auboni Essence: Yeah, that's what I was gonna get at is I didn't, hi.

Um, I didn't feel like I had one. Um, then I started laughing because I grew up in a neighborhood that's next to a private school.

[00:41:32] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:41:32] Auboni Essence: And so, but the private school didn't want us on their property. We didn't care. Um, so we would, uh, either hop the fence or break the chains. Somebody in the neighborhood, I don't know who actually like.

Cut the fence and ripped it back.

[00:41:51] Michael Zarick: Like a little entrance type thing.

[00:41:53] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Um, and all we really wanted to do was just utilize their facilities. Um, specifically like the basketball court and the track. Those were the main things that were calling to us. Um, because of that, they ended up taking the hoops off of the courts.

So like we couldn't, there was no incentive really to be there. Um, but that was the Third Space that we created as children. Um, and then, you know, when I went to college, I was full-time school, full-time work, so I didn't really have time for a Third Space.

[00:42:23] Michael Zarick: You

[00:42:24] Auboni Essence: got I-U-P-U-I, I went to Budler.

[00:42:25] Michael Zarick: Budler, okay.

[00:42:25] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm. Um, and so like maybe my Third Space was the library. Like that's just what I wanna say, but every library I've been to is still there. And so I don't think that there is one,

[00:42:37] Michael Zarick: don't think of it. Like physically Okay. Or necessarily physically.

[00:42:40] Auboni Essence: Okay. Um. Um, then my childhood porch, my mom sold our house.

So like, that would be my Third Space.

[00:42:48] Michael Zarick: Oh yeah.

[00:42:49] Auboni Essence: That's gone for me.

[00:42:50] Michael Zarick: Have you, have you ever driven by your house that was sold?

[00:42:52] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:42:52] Michael Zarick: And you like, look at it?

[00:42:53] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[00:42:54] Michael Zarick: There, my childhood home, we not, we, I was not involved in this transaction. I

[00:42:59] Auboni Essence: wasn't either.

[00:42:59] Michael Zarick: Uh, but, uh, my mom sold it and well, I drive by or walk by sometimes when I'm in Louisville and be like, why did they do that?

Yeah. Like they painted our door yellow. Oh. And they like built like this ugly fence. It's 'cause they have kids and a dog. Yeah. So I get why.

[00:43:18] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:43:18] Michael Zarick: But also it's so ugly. Um,

[00:43:21] Auboni Essence: two thumbs down.

[00:43:22] Michael Zarick: Yeah. And like, there's like, um, you talk about, we were talking about yearning, but yearning is not the, I think the feeling, it's sort of like.

It's no longer mine. And that's cool in a way. Mm-hmm. But there's still like a piece of me that's left there.

[00:43:42] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Well it's, I would, I would classify it as yearning for me in like a nostalgic way.

[00:43:47] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:43:47] Auboni Essence: Um, I didn't want her to sell the house. It's back on the market right now. I've thought about it.

You're like, I'm getting in there. Yeah. Um, so, so yeah, that's a, like, I just, and they did do some renovations. They renovated, um, my mom's bathroom and my bathroom, but everything else, to be honest, is like sweat equity that my mom and I put in that home. So there used to be carpet. We pulled up the carpet to reveal the original hardwood floor.

They still have that. Mm-hmm. Because it's good quality hardwood floor. Um,

[00:44:19] Michael Zarick: classic seventies stuff. I feel like people put in shag rug and you're like taking it out.

[00:44:23] Auboni Essence: Yes. Um, and then like, and they renovated the, the kitchen a little bit. The cabinets, they made, the cabinets the same, but everything else in that home, from what I could see on Zillow, is the same.

Yeah. But yeah, so I'd say that's kind of just like what, I'm longing. I'm a Third Space. Maybe that's a difficult question for me to answer. I'm gonna be thinking about that.

[00:44:43] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:44:44] Auboni Essence: Yeah. So, well, you

[00:44:45] Michael Zarick: can text me.

[00:44:45] Auboni Essence: I will.

[00:44:45] Michael Zarick: We'll edit it in. You'll like, send me a voicemail, like drop it. Except this is coming out in three days, so.

[00:44:51] Auboni Essence: Oh, okay. Well, hopefully send me two hours is enough time. Um,

[00:44:58] Michael Zarick: every episode I ask a question

[00:45:00] Auboni Essence: Okay.

[00:45:01] Michael Zarick: From the previous guest.

[00:45:02] Auboni Essence: Oh. Which means I get to come up with a question.

[00:45:05] Michael Zarick: Correct. Most people don't catch onto that for some reason. Oh, okay. Uh, my previous guest, her name was aj.

[00:45:13] Auboni Essence: Okay.

[00:45:13] Michael Zarick: Um, you saw her, yeah. She owns a pole studio. Yeah. Called did FIT Studio. Sorry, I, I don't know why it always escapes me.

[00:45:21] Auboni Essence: That's all right.

[00:45:22] Michael Zarick: She asked the question, what are you more afraid of the deep ocean or outer space?

[00:45:31] Auboni Essence: The deep ocean. This is a hard one. Um, 'cause I'm, I'm afraid of them for different reasons. Like the deep ocean, you get deep enough and you'll just like, you know, um, but then like outer space, you know, if you don't have all the things that you need, you'll like break into pieces when you'll freeze instantly and break into pieces.

[00:45:52] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[00:45:52] Auboni Essence: Um,

[00:45:53] Michael Zarick: what if you were fully safe

[00:45:55] Auboni Essence: in both

[00:45:56] Michael Zarick: spaces, in exploring them?

[00:45:58] Auboni Essence: Shit, it's so hard. It's so hard because like, because the place that I would go to, if I could go any, if I could go anywhere in the world is the bottom of the ocean because nobody's been there. Like, if I could go there safely, that's where I would go.

So I wanna say that I, because of that, I'm more afraid of space. I'm gonna say that.

[00:46:20] Michael Zarick: That's so funny.

[00:46:20] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:46:21] Michael Zarick: I, I'm afraid of space. Just because like when you like start to think about it, you're like, oh my god.

[00:46:28] Auboni Essence: Yeah. But that also makes me wanna go like. Yeah. Like it, this is hard, but

[00:46:34] Michael Zarick: it's like, it's like Ninety-Nine 0.9 9 9 9 9 9 repeating nothing,

[00:46:39] Auboni Essence: which is fine.

[00:46:39] Michael Zarick: Which is horrifying.

[00:46:40] Auboni Essence: And I still wanna go. Yeah.

[00:46:44] Michael Zarick: That's freaks me out.

[00:46:44] Auboni Essence: I think the GForce is what, what really scares me and just like the possibility of having like a stroke from not having everything that I need

[00:46:52] Michael Zarick: mm-hmm.

[00:46:52] Auboni Essence: In that moment.

[00:46:53] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:46:54] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:46:54] Michael Zarick: Are you like into, well you talk about not going to see happy movies, but

[00:47:00] Auboni Essence: did me do, so

[00:47:02] Michael Zarick: there's a movie out right now, it's called, uh,

[00:47:03] Auboni Essence: yeah.

Project Mill. Harry, hail Mary.

[00:47:05] Michael Zarick: Probably Hail Mary.

[00:47:06] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:47:06] Michael Zarick: Um,

[00:47:06] Auboni Essence: I wanna see it. I heard it was a book though, so I want to like read the book.

[00:47:10] Michael Zarick: Um, but there's this, I think like people will talk about the optimism in the movie, but I also think there's this like, it's reminiscent of like very sixties mentality American, where it's like space, the final front, like Star Trek space.

The front frontier. There's this like amazing adventure that's waiting out there.

[00:47:30] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:47:31] Michael Zarick: Um, interesting that I think that, um, or like, you know, as much as I don't like talking about Elon Musk or whatever, but it's like this idea that Mars is the next place we could go.

[00:47:46] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:47:46] Michael Zarick: But when we talk about, um, appreciating what we have presently mm-hmm.

In our, in our existing, uh, environment. Mm-hmm. Like, um, like we, I have everything I want here. Yeah. I don't know. Sometimes it's like balancing that again, yearning for like adventure or like something new and exciting. Yeah. But like also appreciating the things that you have right outside your, your big window.

[00:48:13] Auboni Essence: Yeah. I, um, my interest in space does not come from like a space of, um, no pun intended, like wanting to bring. The systems we have here to space.

[00:48:28] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:48:28] Auboni Essence: Like when I was telling my best friend about this, she was just like, yeah, I don't wanna do that because like, I don't wanna have to like pay to enter and exit space.

Yeah. I don't wanna have to be on space and here's this ad, like, you

[00:48:38] Michael Zarick: don't wanna be a space surf.

[00:48:40] Auboni Essence: Yeah,

[00:48:41] Michael Zarick: I know what you're saying. And

[00:48:42] Auboni Essence: like, um, and, and my desire to explore didn't even include any of that. It was just like, let's go to these, these different worlds and be very careful and appreciative and wherever we can actually, let's like not even touch anything because I, this is story we had to read and it's where the butterfly effect comes from.

Basically, you know, they went back in time, they were like, don't get off the path. This guy got off the path, stepped on a butterfly, and that changed when they came back to the present time, that changed everything that there was in that story. And so like, what would it look like if we just went and we had.

Our like floating machines and devices and things and we just like didn't interact, we just observed. What's the likelihood of that? Eh, probably minimal, but like for multiple reasons. But that's just kind of where it came from for me, is like I just have a desire to know and to see and to just kind of understand as much as possible while still being respectful and so, yeah.

Yeah. But to your point of appreciating everything that we have here, like we are like earth bound creatures, so like we should do everything that we can to protect our planet. Mm-hmm. I'm just a curious person. Like I have no desire to start colonizing another planet. Mars included. Like,

[00:50:03] Michael Zarick: oh, Mars doesn't even excite me.

[00:50:05] Auboni Essence: No,

[00:50:06] Michael Zarick: they don't have wifi there.

[00:50:07] Auboni Essence: They don't have oxygen or the same level of gravity that we

[00:50:12] Michael Zarick: have. Yeah. There's a lot wrong with that place,

[00:50:13] Auboni Essence: you know?

[00:50:14] Michael Zarick: Um,

[00:50:15] Auboni Essence: yeah.

[00:50:16] Michael Zarick: Is there anything else you would like to talk about?

[00:50:20] Auboni Essence: Um, I am a 2026 Art and Soul artist and Oh,

[00:50:23] Michael Zarick: that's right.

[00:50:24] Auboni Essence: Oh my God. And I was,

[00:50:25] Michael Zarick: that was like one of the big things I asked you about.

I'm so glad you brought that up.

[00:50:27] Auboni Essence: No, it's cool. I was like, dang, we, we talked, we had a great conversation and I never even brought up.

[00:50:32] Michael Zarick: No, please. It's cool. I, I'm also interested in this.

[00:50:35] Auboni Essence: Yes. So Art and Soul has been going on for 30 years. We are the 30th cohort to come out of this. It started as something to highlight, um, black artists and black music, um, for the month of February.

And it has grown to a year long cohort. So we will be performing and gigging starting next weekend, all the way through October. And you can catch myself. D'yshe Mansfield, um, Ken Wave AKA Kinney, and, uh, Dr. Austin, Dean Ashford. We are this year's cohort, um, just presenting our artwork. We have an art and Soul Sunday performance.

Each one of us has our own Sunday where it'll be an hour for you to engage with us in our artwork. And then we have different opportunities to just perform in different spaces throughout the city. And so at the nap tones, the Sunday actually myself, Dasha and Kenny will, they're part of my band that I just piece together.

They're my friends.

[00:51:33] Michael Zarick: She use the word

[00:51:36] Auboni Essence: Yes, I did. Um, and I am, um, like before you finish the question, I thought the question was just gonna be what scares you. Mm-hmm. And honestly, this opportunity kind of is a little scary. I've applied for it maybe two or three times, and this year I finally got it and now it's like, oh shit.

[00:51:56] Michael Zarick: Was there like a sense of like, why am I still applying to this,

[00:51:59] Auboni Essence: um,

[00:52:00] Michael Zarick: ever.

[00:52:03] Auboni Essence: I wouldn't say that it was more so like, there was this sense of disbelief, like, I'm applying and I probably won't get it, but I'm gonna apply. Um, but I, I don't know if I would categorize that as like, why am I still applying to this?

Um, just, I just didn't believe I was gonna get it, but then I got it, now I'm here and now it's like, oh shit. Like I have to do it. I have to, I have to execute.

[00:52:30] Michael Zarick: You're like, I didn't think I would be in this position.

[00:52:32] Auboni Essence: Yeah. You know, which is crazy. So like, if there's anything to take from that, it's believing yourself because somebody's gonna say yes at some point out of a thousand nos, it's gonna be a yes at some point.

And when that yes comes, you can't be like not ready to go. You have to, you have to walk into it with the same confidence and understanding and belief in yourself.

[00:52:52] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm. '

[00:52:52] Auboni Essence: cause somebody else saw that. And I think it's really easy for artists to lose that. Um, 'cause we're all sensitive. Every last one of us.

[00:53:03] Michael Zarick: What, what does it mean to like, uh, what does it mean to like, perform?

[00:53:07] Auboni Essence: Oh, what an excellent question. Um,

[00:53:12] Michael Zarick: because you said like, perform your art, but like, one time I got in like an hour long discussion at Indiana Humanities.

[00:53:20] Auboni Essence: Cool.

[00:53:20] Michael Zarick: About the difference between arts and humanities.

[00:53:22] Auboni Essence: Okay.

[00:53:23] Michael Zarick: And you are primarily a writer.

[00:53:25] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:53:26] Michael Zarick: Which for them would fall under humanities.

[00:53:29] Auboni Essence: Oh.

[00:53:29] Michael Zarick: So, and you said My art. Um, so I'm not trying to, uh, discuss the necessarily semantics. Um, but like, for you, like what does it mean to perform whatever you're creating?

[00:53:41] Auboni Essence: like performance I guess for me just means being able to, to read or recite my work. And, and shout out to my friends because I have gotten up in the middle of the living room and just been like, can I reach out this thing? And my one friend was like, oh, no, I'm scared. And I was like, why? What are you scared for?

And so then I, my other friend had never seen me do this before though, so she was just like, she's like, oh, like you finna perform it right here? And I was like, yeah, absolutely. Why wouldn't I do it any other way? Um, and so from living rooms to coffee houses, to bookstores to just grander stages, like that is kind of like what it means for me.

Mm-hmm. It's just being able to read or recite my work to someone. I just want them to like to hear it, to give me feedback to mm-hmm. Tell me what it was that they felt. Tell me what it was that they didn't feel like. That's kinda like what it means for me And for arts and humanities, like, I mean. It feels a little synonymous, but it also just like, it also is like the nuances of like literary artwork, I don't feel get the justice that they deserve.

Um, specifically

[00:55:02] Michael Zarick: the writing stuff

[00:55:03] Auboni Essence: specifically like hip hop. Like hip hop is a, is a literary work. Like when people are giving you double, triple, quadruple entendres, like that is literary work. That is not, that is a play on words. Like this is, and words are pretty detrimental to literary work. Mm-hmm. Um, and I don't think that that conversation gets brought up enough about the different types of literary work.

And so,

and so I look, I say all this to say that like. Literary is so broad, but it had, we have been encouraged to look at it so narrowly. So are you a published author? So, um, oh, did you get your essay published in this thing? Like, oh, like, did you, uh, do you have a book? Can I, can I sign your book? Can I buy your book?

And it's like, I, nah, I mean, some of my stuff you just gotta come and see me. Or here's a YouTube link. Mm-hmm. Um, or here's an audio file, no pun intended, as an audio file. And that was gesture Your Way. Well, but yeah.

[00:56:09] Michael Zarick: Well, it even like plays into that idea of like this capitalist mentality of what defines success.

[00:56:15] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:56:16] Michael Zarick: Have you made money off your work?

[00:56:17] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:56:18] Michael Zarick: That is how you define a successful author.

[00:56:20] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:56:21] Michael Zarick: Or writer. Or artist or whatever word you want to use. Yeah. Versus like, I would consider you successful because you are creating space for people to share their stuff.

[00:56:31] Auboni Essence: Thank you so much.

[00:56:32] Michael Zarick: Yeah,

[00:56:32] Auboni Essence: I appreciate that.

I'm glad you brought that up because I'm also doing quarterly workshops this year, so that's a literal space I'm carving out for people to come and like write and if they would like to share, they can. If they don't, there's no pressure in my workshops. It's just a space to get the brain juices flowing in the imagination.

Growing.

[00:56:52] Michael Zarick: Sorry. I was like, there's a rhyme in there. Um, when you talked about, um, wanting to get a reaction or like whatever reaction means Yeah. From someone else.

[00:57:04] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[00:57:05] Michael Zarick: Does that, do you need that to come from a, like, do you appreciate it more when it comes from a certain source or is there a you don't really care, it's just how you just like having the impact.

[00:57:21] Auboni Essence: Um, I definitely would say like my, my friends and family matter a little bit more than any random stranger. And also I try not to discount the random stranger, um, because, you know, like, not everybody's gonna love you, right? And so I say this with, um, with the understanding that I am still protected and I'm going to remain in my protective barrier.

Um, but if someone comes up to me and they're just like, you know, I didn't really like that poem for X, y, z reason, then I'm gonna like allow myself to sit with it, but I don't think I would, uh, I'm going to actively work to not have, have it consume

[00:58:09] Michael Zarick: me. Mm-hmm.

[00:58:10] Auboni Essence: Um, because again, as artists, we're all sensitive.

And so if you tell me that you don't like something, for something that I think is a valid reason other than. It hurt my feelings or you're, you're making it out to be all insert noun here. When it's not all insert noun, then like, that sounds like you've got some things you need to do and unpack when you're alive and got shit to do with me.

Um, but if there's a, a legitimate reason of like, um, it didn't take into account, uh, this perspective, which is valid for this reason, that's different.

[00:58:45] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[00:58:46] Auboni Essence: That's challenging me to grow. That's challenging me to research more about something that I took time to not only write about but then to perform.

Um, which means that there was a, there was a, a hole in my research, right? And so like, that's, that's just like really important. Regardless of that though, having, um, trusted like writers in my, in my circle, review my work and give me honest feedback and just having the. Um, and honest feedback from my friends and family matters the absolute most.

They're like equal, equal playing field.

[00:59:22] Michael Zarick: Totally.

[00:59:22] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Cool.

[00:59:24] Michael Zarick: Two last questions.

[00:59:25] Auboni Essence: Sure. As many as you want. I'm having a good conversation.

[00:59:28] Michael Zarick: Well, I can go all day. Well, I do have a sort of, what, do you know what time? It's,

[00:59:32] Auboni Essence: um, let's see. It is 12. 1220. We've been talking for a while.

[00:59:37] Michael Zarick: Okay. I gotta stop soon.

[00:59:38] Auboni Essence: Okay.

[00:59:39] Michael Zarick: Because I gotta get to Fountains Square.

[00:59:41] Auboni Essence: Oh, yes. Okay. Yes. Let's be respectful of your time.

[00:59:43] Michael Zarick: I never know how to ask this 'cause it feels like it feels presumptuous.

[00:59:47] Auboni Essence: Okay.

[00:59:48] Michael Zarick: Can you just like rip a poem right now?

[00:59:50] Auboni Essence: Um,

ooh. Here's one that's just like, um, before I met my partner, I, um, before I told my partner that I was interested in him

[01:00:05] Michael Zarick: mm-hmm.

[01:00:06] Auboni Essence: I was unsure if the feelings were being reciprocated and I wrote this poem.

[01:00:11] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[01:00:11] Auboni Essence: It's called Let Me Down Easy. We sit on pumpkin couches and shoot the breeze. So the morning from late evening, I only got one reason that I'm hanging around you.

My mind is telling me not to fall, just to leave. My heart says, girl, please you is off the ground. Boo and clouds with pink sweats and honesty is the best, but I'm afraid 'cause I want you. And before long snows, joy graces me and the boy, and I find that I still haven't told you that I want you around.

Because if you only see me as a friend, then I don't wanna know, and if you're playing me and keep that shit on the field, 'cause I kicked my confidence to the curb when I learned that friendship is your top priority while listening to Miguel on the radio. But I muster every bit of courage to tell you that all I want is you.

And this could be a sure thing if you tell me that I like girls like you and teach me how to love you to the moon and back. I'd never stop loving you. I'd always have your back. I'd write my piece to you about love and profess it on every single track. But alas, if you don't feel the same for me, then please, please just be sure to let me down.

Easy. He like me, so it don't matter.

[01:01:21] Michael Zarick: Did you like read that to like, to them?

[01:01:24] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[01:01:26] Michael Zarick: You feel like this is how we're, like, this is how we're breaking up right now?

[01:01:29] Auboni Essence: No, we're not breaking up. I read that. Yeah. No, no. We don't wanna break up poem anyways. Um, we actually, quick aside, I have done that to somebody. Uh,

[01:01:40] Michael Zarick: I'm dead.

[01:01:41] Auboni Essence: Um, I performed it on stage while they were in the audience.

[01:01:46] Michael Zarick: That's crazy.

[01:01:47] Auboni Essence: It was not the most tasteful moment in my life.

[01:01:50] Michael Zarick: Did, did the room pick up on it?

[01:01:52] Auboni Essence: Yes. But the thing here, here's, here's my problem, here's my problem. Okay.

[01:01:56] Michael Zarick: We're airing beef today.

[01:01:58] Auboni Essence: I know. I didn't know that everyone would pick up on it.

[01:02:03] Michael Zarick: Mm.

[01:02:03] Auboni Essence: Genuinely I didn't. Or I, I, I'm not that evil of a person. I got up there and was like, yeah, like, I'm just gonna spit this poem that I wrote. But everybody picked up on it. Everyone who knew in me, in my life picked up on it. So, yeah. Not one of my finest moments. Um, but yeah,

[01:02:21] Michael Zarick: I wonder if that's like,

[01:02:23] Auboni Essence: I'm now, I'm now more emotionally intelligent from that and I won't be doing that.

[01:02:27] Michael Zarick: Yeah. I wonder if there's like a man, I thought my writing lacks settled or had subtlety that it just like didn't in the moment.

[01:02:34] Auboni Essence: Yeah, that's

[01:02:35] Michael Zarick: exactly what it's, and it's almost like a man that was a really effective, like, growth as a writer.

[01:02:40] Auboni Essence: It was.

[01:02:40] Michael Zarick: You're like, man, I, I really messed up, but

[01:02:43] Auboni Essence: there you go.

[01:02:43] Michael Zarick: Uh, thank you.

[01:02:44] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

Yeah. I I did that. Um, haven't done it again. Won't do it again. But I, I did, I thought that there was more, um, it was more hidden, subtle than it really was. It was definitely

[01:02:56] Michael Zarick: Was the person present.

[01:02:58] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[01:02:59] Michael Zarick: Oh, wait, you said that

[01:03:00] Auboni Essence: I did.

[01:03:01] Michael Zarick: Dang.

I don't know who it is, but I'm sorry that happened to you also, you know, I'm sorry that they made you feel that way. Whatever thought that was, you know,

[01:03:11] Auboni Essence: and you know what? I apologize as well. We have not spoken in a long time. Yeah, yeah. And I did not, um, I did not, and have not considered how you might have felt about that, so I apologized.

[01:03:23] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[01:03:24] Auboni Essence: I just knew I was getting my thing off my chest in that moment. But like I said, you have to grow and I'm a little bit more emotionally intelligent from that experience. Yeah. So, um, I welcome that growth while also, um, acknowledging the fact that I messed up.

[01:03:42] Michael Zarick: Yeah. How old are you now?

[01:03:43] Auboni Essence: 28. I was like 24.

[01:03:47] Michael Zarick: Sorry. You started, you started organizing That Peace Open Mic when you were 19, which was crazy.

[01:03:52] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Uh, I mean, Mariah started earlier than that. Yeah. So,

[01:03:56] Michael Zarick: and I think that's like, that's so incredible and to like, think about the mistakes. I made when I was younger, which I do a lot. Uh, we doing self-reflection is so important and like, you know, you clearly haven't lingered that heavily, but, um, like, don't linger on the mistakes you've made.

Just focus on how you can improve and go forward and stuff like that. Yeah.

[01:04:16] Auboni Essence: I appreciate that.

[01:04:17] Michael Zarick: Um,

[01:04:18] Auboni Essence: cool.

[01:04:18] Michael Zarick: All right, let's wrap up 'cause I do,

[01:04:20] Auboni Essence: yeah, you gotta go.

[01:04:21] Michael Zarick: Have to go. what question?

[01:04:23] Auboni Essence: Oh fuck. Especially

[01:04:25] Michael Zarick: would you like to ask the next Third Space Indy Guest?

[01:04:29] Auboni Essence: Um, a lot of my work right now has been trying to answer the question, uh, about what is freedom reimagined to me.

And, um, I think like that's a very large question. So to kind of narrow it a little bit, I'm asking people to,

what are some elements of a world that you would want to live in? That's what I got.

[01:05:01] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[01:05:02] Auboni Essence: Because I don't want people to like, I want people to feel like that they can just list something, but if they wanna just go full fledge and just describe the world that they wanna live in, I'm down with that too.

[01:05:11] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[01:05:12] Auboni Essence: But yeah, just like elements of a world you would want to live in and like why, why those elements? I think transit is a big one for you.

[01:05:20] Michael Zarick: I, transit is a big one for me. There's a lot more too. Um,

[01:05:23] Auboni Essence: yeah.

[01:05:24] Michael Zarick: Well you mentioned like, I also like to answer the question. I'm not that much of a rush. transit's obviously a huge one, but I also really like wanna live in a world where I would call the current moment we're in, uh, a low trust society.

[01:05:42] Auboni Essence: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

[01:05:43] Michael Zarick: A lot of that has to do with post COVID. A lot of that has to do with the political climate. A lot of that has to do with a lot of factors. Um, including and never limited to capitalism. Um. Live in a world where you can like fully trust everyone you interact with.

[01:06:03] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:06:04] Michael Zarick: Um, you know, I do it like I leave doors unlocked that I probably shouldn't and like, um, or like walk into places with a certain like gumption that maybe I shouldn't.

A lot of that comes with being a large white dude as I mentioned earlier. Mm-hmm. But like, um, just like being able to trust everyone regardless of, um, like what your current situation is. Mm-hmm. And I think that's something that we really struggle with right now. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

[01:06:34] Auboni Essence: Um,

[01:06:34] Michael Zarick: there's a lot of like hesitation around interpersonal relationships and, and stuff like that.

[01:06:39] Auboni Essence: Mm. I love that. I've never thought about the trust element, but that makes sense. Like I, uh, like I'm trying to build a world around that where trust is higher than what it is now. But I never thought of it in that way, but that's, that's exactly. What is needed.

[01:06:55] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[01:06:56] Auboni Essence: Um, just trusting your neighbor. I'm about to reach out to my neighbor, see if they wanna hang out.

[01:07:01] Michael Zarick: Like you're literal.

[01:07:02] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:07:03] Michael Zarick: I actually, yeah, I do need to do that. Um, I have one neighbor, her name is, uh oh. No. What's the girl from Finding Nemo? Who like shakes the bag?

[01:07:14] Auboni Essence: Oh, Darla. Darla.

[01:07:15] Michael Zarick: Yeah.

[01:07:16] Auboni Essence: Oh,

[01:07:16] Michael Zarick: wow. That's, that's her name. She's like an older lady. Her name's Darla. Um, she's like really nice. It's like, it's fun to talk to her.

Uh, but there's like so many other neighbors all around me Yeah. That are a variety of people that I have never interfaced with at all. And I just know that at least some of them are good people. So it'd be cool to like reach out and be like, what's up? I'm over here.

[01:07:38] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:07:38] Michael Zarick: Um, yeah. Cool. Amazing question. So what are some elements of a world you wanna live in?

[01:07:43] Auboni Essence: Yes.

[01:07:44] Michael Zarick: Great question.

[01:07:45] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:07:45] Michael Zarick: Hey, thanks so much for joining me, Auboni on this.

Thank

[01:07:48] Auboni Essence: you for having me.

[01:07:49] Michael Zarick: Just Auboni?

[01:07:50] Auboni Essence: Yes. Um.

[01:07:52] Michael Zarick: Can you tell the people

[01:07:53] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:07:53] Michael Zarick: Where they can find you?

[01:07:54] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:07:55] Michael Zarick: Your work, your projects, whatever you're doing.

[01:07:57] Auboni Essence: Yeah. So you can follow me on Instagram at Auboni_Essence. That's AUB as in boy, ON as in Nancy.

I essence. Um, that is where like I post everything that I'm doing, particularly on my story. Um, and yeah. Website coming soon. It's loading. No timeline, but it's loading.

[01:08:20] Michael Zarick: We wait. I was told you I worked for a marketing company. Yeah. Earlier, like whenever someone we're working with says, we're working on a website, we know that the timeline of our job gets extended by a month minimum.

It's like, it's like just not as much of a priority as people like think it is.

[01:08:35] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Yeah.

[01:08:36] Michael Zarick: Um. Anything else?

[01:08:38] Auboni Essence: No, that's all I got

[01:08:39] Michael Zarick: is That Peace Open Mic. Have a Instagram.

[01:08:41] Auboni Essence: That piece. Open mic. Does have an open, uh, does have an Instagram. It's at that piece. Open mic. That's P-P-E-A-C-E.

[01:08:49] Michael Zarick: Mm-hmm.

[01:08:49] Auboni Essence: Um, open mic. So that piece.

Open mic. What else? You can follow Arts Council Indy. You can follow Dae Mansfield and Ken Wave and Dr. Austin. Dean Ashford. You can follow the Naptones and Mr. Troy Track select and the select few sessions. Trying to think about, you can follow Mariah Ivy 'cause she's dope as well. Um, these are all the cool people in my circle.

DJ Bay, Brooke Billions. Follow grapevine.

[01:09:13] Michael Zarick: List them off.

[01:09:14] Auboni Essence: Yeah,

[01:09:14] Michael Zarick: I saw, I saw, um, that was actually where it was before. This was, um, Nigel.

[01:09:19] Auboni Essence: Oh, very

[01:09:19] Michael Zarick: cool. Was giving a talk.

[01:09:20] Auboni Essence: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I saw that.

[01:09:21] Michael Zarick: Really cool.

[01:09:22] Auboni Essence: Yeah.

[01:09:23] Michael Zarick: Uh, hey, thanks for watching or listening to this episode of Third Space Indy. You can find me

[01:09:28] Auboni Essence: mm-hmm.

[01:09:29] Michael Zarick: At Third Space Indy on Instagram or by going to Third Space Indy dot com. Uh, if you want. You can gimme your email. I write a blog. I promise to get back on that. Uh, no timeline. Yeah. Thanks City Rising for sponsoring the podcast. Also, as always, shout out to the local artist Jennasen for letting me use your song, Scared Rabbit as the intro music.

[01:09:55] Auboni Essence: Thanks to Loudmouth for having us as well.

[01:09:57] Michael Zarick: Oh, thank you to Loudmouth for having us. Shout out to Kelly for letting us in and being so friendly. Bye

[01:10:02] Auboni Essence: bye.